Extreme Makeover - The Entries

[Fred Weiss]

We have a total of 33 entries in the Extreme Makeover Design Contest. Vote once for your favorite. Voting ends in 2 weeks at 11:30 PM, Saturday, May 19, 2007.

Entry #1
http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42201.jpg

Replicator

[Fred Weiss]

Project Notes: I figured it would be done on MDO w/ 4x4 wood posts and
pre-fab decorative post tops, along with the mounting hardware.

With that in mind, I could get the job done for around $600.00 to $700.00 for everything.

Entry #2

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42601a.jpg

Ground Chuck

[Fred Weiss]

Project Notes: I figured it would be done on MDO w/ 4x4 wood posts and
pre-fab decorative post tops, along with the mounting hardware.

With that in mind, I could get the job done for around $600.00 to $700.00 for everything.

Entry #3

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42601b.jpg

Ground Chuck

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #4

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42702.jpg

Signage

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #5

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42802.jpg

Ken

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #6

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42805.jpg

Bladegraphics

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #7

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42903.jpg

Isign

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #8

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50302.jpg

Jillbeans

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #9

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50305.jpg

Flame Master

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #10

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50501.jpg

Jillbeans

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #11

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50504.jpg

Stevo Design

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #12

Project notes:

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50507a.jpg

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50507b.jpg

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50507c.jpg

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50507d.jpg

Vid

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #13

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42301.jpg

Replicator

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #14
Project Notes: Scope of work:
1. Remove existing sectional sign top panel from both sides.
2. Cut off tops of posts (if neccasary) at 34" above existing sign bottom sections.
3. Apply decorative top caps to posts.
4. Paint posts and caps Blue (color match new sign border)
5. Supply and Install* (2) New full color** 38"h x 48"w Dibond sign panels (per supplied proof)

* Install new signs over existing panels, using 3M V.H.B. tape and Contractors Adhesive.
** (A) Digital Printed Media Laminated or (B) Cut Vinyl & Hand Painted

Price: $991.44 (U.S.) ( sales tax & removed panel*** disposal included)

*** Subject to recycle or re-use for future signage projects by xxxx sign co.

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42701.jpg

Signosaurus Rex

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #15

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42703.jpg

Holeshotrob

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #16

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42803.jpg

Flame Master

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #17

Project Notes: Just tried to keep it classic to fit in with the idea of antiques, but used the red to make it stand out on the road. A little paint and some new vinyl would do wonders.

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42901.jpg

Torgy97

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #18

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em43001.jpg

Stevo Design

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #19

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50303.jpg

Jillbeans

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #20

Project Notes: Since the budget was $995.00. i would use the same sign i would repaint the existing sign panels black and install a cutout MDO overlay over the sign to give it a little more dimension to it the overall size of the cutout would be 48"x30"

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50401.jpg

Tikiboyz

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #21

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50502.jpg

Wannabe

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #22

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50505.jpg

Holeshotrob

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #23

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50508.jpg

Deaton Design

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #24

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42401.jpg

Bluttr

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #25

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42801.jpg

Geb

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #26

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42804.jpg

Flame Master

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #27

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em42902.jpg

Isign

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #28

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50301a.jpg

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50301b.jpg

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50301c.jpg

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50301d.jpg

GAC05

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #29

Project Notes; I went ahead and included a version showing the other side since I got asked by a guy here how it was going to work.

For the record we'd do this sign on MDO with the guy done as a digital print, the rest a combination of paint and vinyl. We'd do two faces mount them on 4" x4" posts. We'd cover the gap between the two panels with 5" wide strips of black aluminum, applied with silicone and just enough tacks to hold it in place until the silicone had set.

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50304a.jpg

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50304b.jpg

Pat Whatley

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #30

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50402.jpg

Bluttr

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #31

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50503.jpg

Geb

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #32

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50506.jpg

Checkers

[Fred Weiss]

Entry #33

Project Notes: The sign would be digitally printed on Orajet 3551 and laminated with Oraguard 290G, mounted to Nu-Alum 1/2" (Good 2 Sides). Since Jim is willing to help me install it (and pay cash) and invited me to his annual pig roast, I decided I would only charge him $100 to install this which brings my total to $990.32.

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50509a.jpg

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/em_entries/em50509b.jpg

Njsigns

[Replicator]

There are some absolutely fantastic entires here folks . . . !

Here's to a job well done . . . and to some very creative genius . . . !

:beer :beer :beer :beer :beer :beer :beer :beer :beer :beer

[indepmo]

Amazing! So neat to see so many ideas all in one thread!
Good job all.

[Ken]

Naturally, I have to agree.
Took me about 5 refreshes to get it all to load.
Hard decision.
Are these all within budget?
Perhaps that should have been part of the exercise. ie: some have provided details of methodology and firm price quote.
Next time...I think that will really help fine tune our quoting skills.
Excellent work everyone!
Cheers!
Ken

[badgeman]

Decisions , Decisions.... I am glad I am not Jim and have to decide which one he wants. Awesome designs. Well done all.

:U Rock:

[geb]

Wow, you guys are awesome. Awesome designs, way to go everyone.

George

[Replicator]

Font ID for #33 PLEASE ? . . . Great Art Work !

Looks an awful lot like : Sheridan Gothic SG-Regular [modified],

but if anyone knows the actual font . . . do tell !

[Stevo]

That's Billhead from Letterhead Fonts.

Stevo

[Replicator]

Thanks Stevo !

[iSign]

great stuff... I narrowed it down to 2 choices in my first run-through... gotta go check the voting rules again... but I already know they are going to force me to pick one (unless I go create a new signs101 user name :rolleyes: )

[Pat Whatley]

Are these all within budget?
Ken

Nobody ever mentioned profit margin.

:tongue:

Is there going to be a runoff after the entries are narrowed down or is this a one and done kind of vote?

[iSign]

OK... ran through again... and ONE entry honestly makes me want to go in the store... even though it's 10,000 miles away.... that "emotion" certainly didn't come from the original sign, nor would I have expected to become curious of a store in another part of the world... but my vote is for the entry that is so compelling... I would have to go check out Jim's!!

[Fred Weiss]

Is there going to be a runoff after the entries are narrowed down or is this a one and done kind of vote?

What you see is what you get.

[iSign]

Are these all within budget?
Perhaps that should have been part of the exercise.
It is part of the excercise Ken, and was discussed somewhat.

I think Fred summed it up with this comment:


This is starting to get way too complicated class. In the final analysis, the entire student body will be the judge (with their votes) as to who stayed withing Jim's budget and who did not.

I will add that I voted for one that I feel was designed with an affordable method of production. There are some really nice designs being voted on that I personally feel have unreaslitic amounts of custom work required in their fabrication.

I encourage voters to remember that this excercise does ask for entries thinking like a sign business... not just like a sign designer.
(mine suck compared to so many... so I'm not looking for votes here... just hoping to see voters remember to judge who stayed within Jim's budget)

[wannabe]

I think if some of these are doable in the assigned budget, I may have to close my shop and just farm out all my work and become a middle man...er...uh...woman, let alone the fabulous amount of talent whose shadows I'm not even qualified to stand in.

[wannabe]

This is my first poll, so is it "Winner take all" or are there different categories? ie; best design, most realistic, consolation, gotta be something for ugliest or a sympathy vote? Just kidding, I read above.

[SBowlerDesign]

So many to choose from, great job everyone.

[Fred Weiss]

This contest is what you make of it. Certain specifications were laid out. These included the minimum content (which includes a directional arrow or pointer) and a budget which was left somewhat open to interpretation.

Your vote should take these things into account. But there is no such requirement. I personally did not vote for the best looking design. I voted for the best looking design for Jim's needs that met the stated specifications.

Food for thought.

[skyhigh]

Fred, I think you should have a poll in which we get to guess who did each design. Submitted in an email to you, of course.

ohhhh and don't forget PRIZES for the one with the most correct guesses.:Big Laugh

[mladams7259]

Skyhigh
Im kinda thinking the same thing as you.

As I scrolled through the thread there were 3 or 4 that I knew EXACTLY which member did the sign because of the style and layout used. It would be nice to guess who did the rest of them. Excellent work folks......

[Jon Aston]

Fred is one prolific and versatile designer!! Holy smokes!! I had no idea!!

Just kiddin'.

I haven't been following this contest, but I must say that I like the idea of there being all anonymous entries. It will be fun to see if some of my guesses are on the money. Heck, guessing could be a whole other contest.

And I agree. That is some really fantastic work there, people!!!!

Thanks for the eye candy.

[Ken]

Yes, we have a nearby sign shop that has a "signature" to it in the way he does a lot of his text. Not all of it. But it is unmistakeable once you are familiar with the style. iSigns comment about an affordable method of production will definately influence my vote.
Still, though, there are many choices even considering that.
Cheers!
Ken

[Geary]

Wow, good stuff guys! :tongue: I do hope the one I voted for wins. It, to me, stands out as THE most with "era" and "substance" .... like a sore thumb....only in the GOOD way. :thumb:

G.

[Marlene]

this is really hard as the ones that I like the most clearly aren't the ones that were done with the budget.

[Holeshotrob]

I could have gone all out as well, but I tried to stay within the guidelines. I think alot of us really did well in doing so. Good job, everyone! Lots of beautiful work here!

[Geary]

Fred,

Marlene and Rob bring up a good point. What if the one that everybody is voting for wins and then it's shown that the job can't be done for $995.00? :tongue:

~G.

[Gino]

Ha.... life just isn't fair....huh ?? Simple, they win the contest, but they lost the contract because they were lowballed by someone else and didn't follow directions.

They'll need to look into how they are either giving their wares away or how to do what the customer requests. That falls into our job description.... last time I looked.


If you can’t follow simple rules, how will you ever make it in ANY business ??

[Steve C.]

Not to sound mean, but I think color choices are poor on most entries. I know
profit margin was not a factor, but several I feel could not be completed on
budget. And a few seem to me to be structurally imposible. I took this into
consideration when I voted. Hope no one takes offence at my observations.
JMHO

[Fred Weiss]

Fred,

Marlene and Rob bring up a good point. What if the one that everybody is voting for wins and then it's shown that the job can't be done for $995.00? :tongue:

~G.

Just as the specifications were set down and were not followed by some contestants, the same is true for many of the voters. I don't feel it is my place to say this is a job that can't be done for $995 and to disqualify it. That is for the voters to say by not voting for it.

It was probably a bad idea to even tie a budget to the contest, but all entries will remain in the competition.

[Checkers]

Hey Geary,
The prize for this contest is that you get to complete the project according to the specs and provided design, then brag about it here :)
I will say that there are a lot of great looking designs, and I could make good money on them if I get to choose the fabrication method. I just wouldn't guarantee how long the sign would last though :)
At the end of the contest we should ask for input from the designers, allowing them to describe their design and fabrication methods. Then choose a few to critique and say what is good or bad about them.

Checkers

[Geary]

If you can’t follow simple rules, how will you ever make it in ANY business ??

I know, I know!!!.........I work out of my garage. I can do it for that price!! :tongue:

(as you know bro...I DO indeed work out of my garage nowadays...but, I WOULDN'T do it for that. hehe....)

~G.

[iSign]

Fred,

Marlene and Rob bring up a good point. What if the one that everybody is voting for wins and then it's shown that the job can't be done for $995.00? :tongue:

~G.

When I mentioned that earlier I noted that while Fred originally said entries that did not comply with the rules would be disqualified... he later said:

"This is starting to get way too complicated class. In the final analysis, the entire student body will be the judge (with their votes) as to who stayed withing Jim's budget and who did not."

So I think it was up to us to judge with rules in mind. Personally I'm not seeing that, but that's just me...

Maybe the leading entry is a $200 digital print of custom carved finials & custom welded posts & brackets, & a $600 design (awesome by any standards!) slapped on a $100 sheet of painted MDO, & made to look like a post and panel sign :Big Laugh

[Geary]

Just as the specifications were set down and were not followed by some contestants, the same is true for many of the voters. I don't feel it is my place to say this is a job that can't be done for $995 and to disqualify it. That is for the voters to say by not voting for it.

It was probably a bad idea to even tie a budget to the contest, but all entries will remain in the competition.


Yeah, but you know what brother? ....this is going to make the point I've said all along. "The DESIGN is what matters in sign making." Talent and experience ALWAYS sanctifies the winner! :wink:

~Gear


ps.....Doug......Good point with the digi print on MDO! :thumb:

[Marlene]

Since this is just for fun and pretend, I pretended that the design I liked and voted for was the second design the person did. The person did a design that fit the budget and then designed a really good one. I pretended that it was an upsell.

[iSign]

I pretended the current leaders design has already been built, (within budget AND profitably) so I could snap this pic:
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
http://www.islandsign.com/6.jpg
-
-
-
-
-
guess I was wrong about the $100 worth of MDO :Big Laugh
(no offense intended... once again, I concede that the current leader is one of the most awesome designs at any price)

[Geary]

LOL. Yes, and I'm actually laughing out loud. :tongue:

[torgy97]

it seems the budget went out the window... there were a lot of designs (much better than mine) that could easily be made for $1000, but I doubt some of the top designs could. But, I do respect those designs a lot as well.

I come from the school of thought not to ask a customer about budget, so that it doesn't affect you. I design and sell what I think the customer needs, at a price I will profit from.

On the next challenge, I suggest general guidelines, (as with this one), but no price constraints... maybe some financial background on the business. Let the winner be chosen just like there were multiple bids on a job. Different designs, different prices.

[njsigns]

I personally know that I aimed to stay within the budget. Had I thrown that budget out the window I could have given Jim an awesome sign, but he was too cheap and I don't work for peanuts. I gave Jim the best sign I could for his budget while remaining profitable for me. Maybe in this imaginary world of Jim's every US dollar is worth 3? If so, I'm moving there today!

Lets also imagine for a minute that the design in the lead was posted in a "how much should I charge" thread. If the designer said he/she was thinking of charging $995, they would be slaughtered here, regardless of their location or fabrication methods. I agree the design is awesome, and I mean no offense, but I can't imagine that sign fitting in Jim's budget on any planet.

Are we comparing apples to apples here? I'm not trying to sound like a cry-baby, but I thought the purpose of this assignment was to have a design that would work for Jim's business and budget, but more importantly, remain profitable for MINE. Just a few thoughts....

Gene

[SignosaurusRex]

The current leading entry is a fabulous design. A very nice display of creativity and design skills. Very excellent work! No doubt that the sign can be produced within budget guidelines. The design alone is worth the $995.00, If it contains ALL of what the customer requests. Jim (for all intents and purpose) requested the following items to be included in the design proposal... 1) Business name (JIM'S EMPORIUM). 2) Phone number. 3) ARROW or DIRECTIONAL POINTER. As the customer, my question while reviewing the proposal, would have to be, "Is this really what I requested"? Very nice! yet missing 33% of the request and wrong name. Food for Thought. I don't mean to be harsh, but thats reality.

[Replicator]

With thirty votes so far the guidelines are just out the window.

People are voting on that tremendous design alone, and it is great ! - NO DOUBT.

[javila]

While the leading entry sure is pretty, it would look more in place for a bar.

[Jillbeans]

I think the budget portion of the challenge, while made with good intentions, added confusion.

But all this designery stuff doesn't really work for me with this type of job. It's not really a logo design, it's a sign layout.
If I were to charge someone $900 for a sign design, I wouldn't get many jobs.
Not to stir the pot.

If Jim had actually approached me (which would never happen, as you can tell by his sign which is about 5 miles down the road from me) he would have asked for pretty much what he already has...red block letters on a white background.
You can lead a customer to a fancy design, but you can't make them buy it!
:)
Some of these layouts are really great, and it was hard to choose just one.
Love....Jill

[Marlene]

That's the sign I voted for and unless it's made with cardboard, there is very little chance of it coming in at the budget price. I just loved it and in my pretend world, I think Jim would too and would spring for the extra to make it.

I didn't design a sign for the contest as in the real world, I wouldn't be able to design a sign, make it, take down and dispose of the old and install a new one with new posts so I would have had to tell Jim to take a hike or pony up some more cash.

[iSign]

Just as the specifications were set down and were not followed by some contestants, the same is true for many of the voters. I don't feel it is my place to say this is a job that can't be done for $995 and to disqualify it.

I agree... the price point is one that we all weigh in on differently on this board... and in the final analysis... it's a judgement call... rather then a clear infraction.

However, with the observation of the missing arrow... I think the integrity of this, & all future signs101 contests requires that this omission be looked at that & held it up to the scrutiny of the stated rules... which is not for us in the peanut gallery to do.... but it seems much more appropriate to suggest after Rex's observation.

[iSign]

I didn't design a sign for the contest as in the real world, I wouldn't be able to design a sign, make it, take down and dispose of the old and install a new one with new posts so I would have had to tell Jim to take a hike or pony up some more cash.

I see some entries used the existing structure. If this job, & this budget were offered to me, I would reface the existing panels with .032 aluminum & cut or printed vinyl. If I didn't have to drive too far, it could be quite profitable by any standards, and include a few hours of design work as well.

[Marlene]

I would have done a reface too, but it wouldn't have won any contest, it would only have looked newer with better looking letters. To win a contest, it would have to be more than like the pretty one that's getting all the votes. You could, maybe do the reface, but all the extras cost cash plus the poles would have to be reworked either by wrapping them or painting. almost forgot the custom brackets. those alone would cost a good deal of cash.

[Gino]

With today’s rip, fart and print programs, I think this price would’ve been totally possible with almost any design along with on-site installation. The posts certainly appeared strong and the panels could’ve had any substrate overlay on it.

Heck, my first entry which wasn’t listed as an entry, even allowed for beer afterwards.

I believe the rules along with the apparent appearance Cheap Jim had, this could’ve been accomplished. These are parameters that customers lay down everyday for their signs. If your everyday work isn’t a contest, what are you creating ?? If a ‘Masterpiece’ isn’t called for, why are you wasting your time ?? The biggest lesson here I believe is being able to follow simple rules or not, not who designed the nicest picture. Remember folks, we’re selling signs… not always blends and pictures.

As Jill said, many did not follow the rules and just did effects in a program. The goal was to create a sign and get Cheap Jim a new sign, not a ‘Marketing Plan’.
Jill told us he was cheap.
Jill didn’t want to stir the pot……..

Hey……..

This is all your fault Jill, for submitting this picture in the first place. lol :Big Laugh

[Checkers]

Man, what a bunch of whiners!

Even though the voting still has a long way to go, we have a pretty clear winner. And, YES that sign can be made and installed for less than a grand and YES, you could make money doing it if you're set up to make those types of signs.

My materials for the design being singled out could be a half sheet of 1/4" thick mill finish aluminum, digital prints, PT posts, hardware, paint and concrete. Assuming I use materials and processes like this on a regular basis, I would figure that the materials alone could retail for about $550.

I still have about $450 for labor, which would be worth about 5-6 hours of labor in a good shop. Knock off an hour for the design and I still have 4-5 hours to finish assemble and install the sign. So, how difficult is it to spray some paint, mount some prints and screw a few screws?

Not that I could or would work like this every day, or charge prices based on my costs alone, but it is possible to make signs like that, at that price and still make money.

One of the many issues about this approach is you'll burn out quick and there's a lot of potential for mistakes, which can cost you a lot more in the long run.

Checkers

[geb]

I was watching a certain #(thinkin that was my design) and noticed a " few" votes. I then looked closer and noticed it wasn't mine, then looked at mine and I had 1 vote more than the design I was watching. Aint it a wonderful life, George Bailey.

[Doyle]

Design #6 is awesome, but highly doubt that anyone capable of designing that IN THEIR RIGHT MIND would do it for less than $1500. That is why it did not get my vote. Just isn't realistic to me at all. The designs look great though! Good job to those who posted, if I had more time I would have done one as well.

[ChicagoGraphics]

I'm curious, Are you going to say who made what design at the end of your contest?

[Flame]

I'd love if at the end of the contest, you put everyone's name next to their design. See who did what.

Yeah, I agree what everyone's saying about the price. If anyone can make that #6 sign for under 1K.... they've lost their MINDS.

But hey, it looks pretty cool. Not what I voted for though...:wink:

[Fred Weiss]

Previously asked and answered. After the voting is completed, the designer's names will be added to each posted entry.

[high impact]

My hats off to a couple of exceptional designs!

[BladeGraphics]

I think you can pull off #6 for under a grand. Some digital prints mounted to 1/2" leftover mdo that was cut to shape. 4x4 posts, The brackets and finials could have been objects from Jim's shop ( this is an imaginary contest, right?), plus some paint ,concrete, and mounting hardware. -just about $300 in supplies,leaving $695 for design, production and installation
1 hour design- ( the design is OK, just looks like clip art and gradients to me)
2 hours production
2 hours installation.
I would charge more than $995, but I could do it for that price and still make some money.
Alot of the other designs are great and I think they would more cost effective and profitable.

[skyhigh]

I think you can pull off #6 for under a grand. Some digital prints mounted to 1/2" mdo that was cut to shape. 4x4 posts, The brackets and finials could have been objects from Jim's shop ( this is an imaginary contest, right?), plus some paint ,concrete, and mounting hardware. -just about $300 in supplies,leaving $695 for design, production and installation
1 hour design- ( the design is OK, just looks like clip art and gradients to me)
2 hours production
2 hours installation.
I would charge more than $995, but I could do it for that price and still make some money.
Alot of the other designs are great and I think they would more cost effective and profitable.

Maybe this is a $600 sign, if he had a scrap half sheet of MDO and a couple bags of concrete left over from another job too.

No offense Blade, but your total time is 5 hours.....if you get the "quick dry" concrete, maybe you can cut that down to 4???

One word.........unrealistic

[Ken]

I can't see designing that #6 in one hour, as Blade suggests.
An evening maybe , if I had the talent...
At the end, perhaps #6 will explain.
Let's get over this.
Cheers!
ken

[Holeshotrob]

At the end, perhaps #6 will explain.
Let's get over this.
Cheers!
ken
I agree! Acknowledge and move on. I'm over it.

[skyhigh]

Amen

[wannabe]

I think my mother must have voted for mine. I was holding out for the least number of votes and was getting there. I like to set goals I can reach.

[skyhigh]

I think my mother must have voted for mine. I was holding out for the least number of votes and was getting there. I like to set goals I can reach.

LOL...now I'm going to have to look at all the designs that have 1 vote.

[wannabe]

Ever have one of those moments when immediately after clicking the "submit" button you start searching for the UNSEND button? I thought about asking Fred if he would NOT put my name by mine. Maybe I should say, "just kidding'' beside it or justify my entry as working with Jim's ACTUAL budget.

[skyhigh]

Ever have one of those moments when immediately after clicking the "submit" button you start searching for the UNSEND button?

Been there, done that. :Big Laugh

[Replicator]

I'm doin' it right now by responding to this post !

[Replicator]

how in the he!! are there only 103 votes so far ?

Don't we have like 5,000,000,000 people on the dang forum

for crimeny sakes alive !

[Fred Weiss]

how in the he!! are there only 103 votes so far ?

Don't we have like 5,000,000,000 people on the dang forum

for crimeny sakes alive !

It is what it is Rep. I've never understood the low tallies.

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/Vote.gif

[high impact]

I think everyone is afraid to vote...almost 2,000 views and only just over 100 votes. WOW

[Fred Weiss]

I think everyone is afraid to vote...almost 2,000 views and only just over 100 votes. WOW

Yes but 2000 views translates, at 5 to 10 views per interested member, to 200 to 400 registered members that have even clicked into the thread.

[wannabe]

Maybe other voters are having difficulty choosing.

[Holeshotrob]

I bet vote for me some are actually vote for me waiting til the last minute vote for me also, to just vote for me draw this thing out. There has to be vote for me some type of subliminal vote for me messaging there vote for me somewhere! Don't you vote for me agree? :wink:

[wannabe]

LMAO! So subtle!

[vid]

(edit)...It was probably a bad idea to even tie a budget to the contest...

I don’t think that was such a bad idea. It’s like those TV shows “What It’s Worth” for real estate in different parts of the country. I gotta admit though, I ain’t movin’ to the birthplace of #6 to sell signs if that’s what it takes to move something out the door for $1000. Iffin’ I’m buying, hellyeah!

For me, this is a price range that’s typical for the kind of stuff I see. Customers coming in looking for a sign solution like this expecting to pay $500. It’s a bit of a push to get them to a more realistic range of $1000 - $1500.

In the contest, I expected to see simple re-facing, decorative posts and custom shapes proposed. I was mostly interested in see what types of materials would be chosen and why. For the most part, I could figure that out and think of things I’d use if it wasn’t explained.

There were a few that I thought added something to the architecture of the signs beyond the typical of what I expected. Most obvious of that is #6 with the Art Deco stuff. Others that made me think of simple embellishments that could be used to doll the structure up are #9, 10, 23 and 29.

#9 has a rather simple crossbar below the sign panel for a hanging sign. To me, it adds an simple element to the sign making it appear bigger and gives it some air. From that, if it were a square tube turned 45 degrees, it’d add another subtle dimension to an otherwise inexpensive sign. ...add one at the top, and it’d be an un-ordinary structure at this price range very inexpensively.

#10 has a similar feel to me adding small panels below the sign panel giving it a touch more volume and texture.

#23 sets the posts closer together making one look at the sign more than the structure around it.

#29 goes all the way to the ground and creates mass by adding the aluminum to the sides.

It’s things like that which can add value and a few more bucks in the pocket fairly inexpensively to get out of the ordinary. I tend to get into production mode in this range and don’t necessarily think of the subtleties.

For that, I think tying a budget to the contest is very important... It makes one have to think a little harder to be creative at budget.

[SignosaurusRex]

I'm in agreement with you there "Vid".

[Marlene]

The only problem that I had with the budget was coming up with a design for free because that is what you would have to do to come up with a beauty like #6. You should have at least $500 in the design alone so it all goes back to under selling our talents when it comes to design work. That leaves $495.00 for material, travel, install and disposing of the old stuff. I don't know about any one else, but there also would be a survey of the site included as you would need to make sure the size is correct (never trust a customer's measurements) and to look at the poles and existing sign to see if it could be refaced or if you would need to start out new.

I'm sure that there are creative ways to come in at the budget but like I said in another post, the sign wouldn't win any contest as it would be simple, start copy with just a little do dad or border to dress it up so that there's no design charge chewing up the budget.

[Checkers]

Ya know, I just had an experience where I lost a bid to a much larger and higher priced product.
I asked my usual questions and the client gave me a size, basic specifications and even a logo to work with. So, I worked within the guidelines of the supplied information.
When I followed up with the client yesterday, I was told about the winning bid. Boy, was I upset with myself for not following my proceedure of offering 3 price ranges - good, better and best.
I guess it serves me right for not following my own policy of giving clients a choice. The sting of this one will not go away for a while :(

Checkers

[THATgirl]

I think people just get busy and don't take the time to vote or enter a design. I knew immediately which ones I liked best. They were all nice...but two of them I felt were perfect for the requirements.

[SignosaurusRex]

VOTE dammit!

[skyhigh]

The only problem that I had with the budget was coming up with a design for free because that is what you would have to do to come up with a beauty.

That, along with ones that did a total replacment (poles and all).
Then you are required to pull permits to both the local municipality along with a state permit for an "off location" sign.

Even without the permit BS, if your talking design, auger holes, cement, and removal of the old, its ALWAYS gonna be over a grand.



PS. good post Vid....and holeshotRob, too funny.

[Marlene]

That's right, I totally forgot the permits!

[vid]

Ya know, I just had an experience where I lost a bid to a much larger and higher priced product... (snip)...
I guess it serves me right for not following my own policy of giving clients a choice. The sting of this one will not go away for a while :(

But, what price range do you start doing that? At even a shop rate of $50/hour on a task in this price range is tough.

Based on the original sign and input, I assumed the customer wasn't all that market savvy and approached it from that angle. I tried not to over commit too many of my own resources. (However, in hindsight, I figure I blew out of budget by a couple hundred being overzealous.)

Still, I tried to leave enough out of the layout to create a dialogue for billable changes and improvements to the piece. I never try to give the customer what they want the first time. That way I can create a dialogue that helps to qualify the customer and gain direction for a sign that will "work" for them. I tend to work to specs and "suggest" or quickly sketch (billable) improvements rather than spend the time laying it out. That way the customer will expect to pay more and I haven't committed more time than is necessary to project. I have to be in front of the customer to pull that off though. Good or bad, that dialogue didn't exist in this contest.

As the contest goes, I thinks it's an interesting view on how others approach tasks of this nature. The arguments in this thread have dealt with both design and pricing. Those are always hot topics in this forum. Even more, it's touched on some aspects of installation. Makes me more competitive in the real world.

That, along with ones that did a total replacment (poles and all).
Then you are required to pull permits to both the local municipality along with a state permit for an "off location" sign. ...

It's county and Jim's cousin is the Supervisor..........

[Geary]

Well, we already have a clear winner. I wouldn't fret too much over any of the stories and possible conditions or issues surrounding it. :wink:

[Pat Whatley]

Well, we already have a clear winner. I wouldn't fret too much over any of the stories and possible conditions or issues surrounding it. :wink:

No we don't. If all the non-voting lurkers out there band together and vote for me I can win in one of the greatest comebacks of all time! It ain't over till it's over.

[Checkers]

I never really had to put that much thought into it Vid. Normally, I could get a good read on the client just by speaking with him. Then I make the decision during my sales pitch.

In this case, however, the client found me through my web site and I was contacted via email.

The reason why I'm upset with myself is because I did research the company and knew that I wasn't dealing with a "poor" mom and pop company. Also, even using their specs, the job worth, at least, several thousand dollars.

Oh well, I guess I have trust my instincts more and figure out a better way to qualify and handle internet "sales calls".

Checkers

[Gino]

Heh-heh..... I voted, and it wasn't for mine....... oh yeah, someone forgot to include it....... :thankyou:

[Fred Weiss]

Heh-heh..... I voted, and it wasn't for mine....... oh yeah, someone forgot to include it....... :thankyou:

And someone forgot to follow the submission instructions. http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/dachshund.gif

[Gino]

I do believe we're talking about the same dumb S**T.........


Well, now ya hurt my feelings, but you can't get me mad, no way, no how..... ?$@^&%$( _ %$@^&*+@ - >*%$#!)}#@..........


:beer :beer :beer :beer :beer

[skyhigh]

It's county and Jim's cousin is the Supervisor..........

Jim is in Pennsylvania, and could very well BE the Supervisor. :Big Laugh

silly California people......

[skyhigh]

Hey Gino, dosen't that hurt man???
Too funny Fred.

[Gino]

No Sky….. not near as much as my inner feelings and being scarred for life now………….


I haven’t felt this bad since they shot ‘Flicka’… or was that ‘F-Troop’ when Wrangler Jane shot Corporal Agarn for stealing Captain Parmenter’s horse from Chief Wild Eagle while Trooper Vanderbilt was keeping watch at the fort ??

[skyhigh]

Lmao

Fred you should feel really, really bad.....

or not.

[Replicator]

Gino,

You're watching entirely too much TV LAND my friend !

[Fred Weiss]

Lmao

Fred you should feel really, really bad.....

or not.

I do sky ... I do ... http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/lpups.gif http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/toilet4.gif http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/sun_playing_with_beachball.gif

[Gino]

Watch ????


I lived it !!!!!!!!!!!! :thumb:

[skyhigh]

Fred, Gino.....you two should be selling tickets.
roflmao

[Fred Weiss]

Fred, Gino.....you two should be selling tickets.
roflmao

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/bugs_bunny.gif http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/roars30.gif http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/banjobs.gif

[skyhigh]

Gino on the left....Fred on the right.... who the heck is that in the middle?

[Fred Weiss]

Metro Goldwyn Mouse :wine-smi:

[skyhigh]

your amazing Fred... I never knew you played the bango. Your one multi-talented dude.

[Replicator]

I Give Up ! http://scosoft.com/s/g/2202c3ee.gif

[Ken]

On the merits of low-priced, high-classed sign-work...tough way to make a living, but do-able...#14 gets my vote.
Cheers!
Ken

[Gino]

Hey Fred…..

I see while you’re strummin’ and a pickin' that thar ol’ banjo, you have ‘Up Doc’ on your chin…………

[Fred Weiss]

Hey Fred…..

I see while you’re strummin’ and a pickin' that thar ol’ banjo, you have ‘Up Doc’ on your chin…………


What's Up Doc? :wink:

[Gino]

Ba-dee ba dee, ba dah, ba dee da dee....


That's All Folks ! ! ! ! !






:thankyou:
I've waited over forty years to tell that joke !!!!

[Replicator]

Ba-dee ba dee, ba dah, ba dee da dee....


<b>That's All Folks ! ! ! ! !</b>

Well Gino,

Apparently you haven't started drinking yet ! . . . or is that your normal slur ?

[Gino]

Nope............ that's my 'Porky the Pig' impression.

[Fred Weiss]

Porky says Ibity Ibity Ibity.

[Gino]

And that's why we all love you Fred..................:U Rock:

[Craig Sjoquist]

wow this was tough I mean tough really great layouts and design ideas with great images of what this place might be picking one well I went with practical, sellable, readable, general, modern look ..not the high dollar one oh well shows what I know lol
freedom is not free

[Pat Whatley]

Ummm....can we extend the voting a couple of weeks? My great comeback is taking a little longer than I expected.

[SignosaurusRex]

I certainly hope that the lack of voting participation displayed in this contest, is not indicative of the participation or the lack thereof, at the voting booths in our public elections. It must just be a case of "putting it off until the last minute", I hope. VOTE NOW!

[Pro Signs & Graphix]

indicative of the participation or the lack thereof, at the voting booths in our public elections

Actually Rex it is. Of the thousands of members here, I would venture to say that maaaybee 5% (possibly 10%) will actively vote on this thread. The same happens in local and national elections - BUT I am waiting 'til the last minute on here :biggrin:

[SignosaurusRex]

Just thought I'd rub a couple sticks together here to see if a spark might actually jump out and set something, or someone ablaze!:wink:

[Replicator]

I certainly hope that the lack of voting is not indicative of the lack of voting in our public elections.

:help:

[Fred Weiss]

Voting ends in 13 hours.

[indepmo]

http://www.kcm.com/a/sqvote.gif

[Replicator]

I'm not sure . . . Is there a clear winner yet :help: LMFAO

[Fred Weiss]

I'm not sure . . . Is there a clear winner yet :help: LMFAO

There has been for some time. It's a battle for the other top finishes with prizes and bragging rights at stake.

[SignosaurusRex]

The unfortunate thing about having a "run-away" winner is that a lot of would-be voters, figure why bother, and don't vote. Kind of takes the fun and excitement out of the contest at that point, but thats the way it goes sometimes. Oh well, at least we don't have to contend with "Hanging chads", late or missplaced bulk ballot returns and recounts at members expense. LOL

[Fred Weiss]

The unfortunate thing about having a "run-away" winner is that a lot of would-be voters, figure why bother, and don't vote. Kind of takes the fun and excitement out of the contest at that point, but thats the way it goes sometimes. Oh well, at least we don't have to contend with "Hanging chads", late or missplaced bulk ballot returns and recounts at members expense. LOL

Those who have not yet voted do not see te vote tally until they vote.

[SignosaurusRex]

Fred, just an FYI, I've been able to see the vote tally since the start and before I ever voted.

[Fred Weiss]

hmmmmmm

[Pat Whatley]

Hey Fred, I just read all six pages of this and I've got a great idea deciding a winner of the next design contest! You can just put the names of everyone who enters into a hat and draw a winner at random. There'd be a whole lot less crying then!

[Fred Weiss]

http://www.allcompu.com/myicons/eye_crying.gif

[300mphGraphics]

hmmmmmm

Might have something to do with the "View Poll Results" button under the poll?

Here are my notes as I perused the entries. 11 wow, 14 very nice, 21 creative title, rest well..., 23 attractive, like the post additions, 29 effective

[Replicator]

Here's how I see it !

They're all really good, but some of us [including me] didn't follow the rules

of the contest and all of the design pre-requisites,

and therefore those entries should not be allowed to count.

I think Fred should cast those entries aside in the final decision and award the

prizes to those who submitted entries and abided by the rules of the contest

as they were layed out initially.

Harsh . . . but TRUE ! ! !

[SignosaurusRex]

Having reviewed all of the entries over and over, again and again, based upon the supplied sign criteria and specifications, overall layout & design, use of colors, kerning/spacing, etc., etc., etc., in my honest opinion, the sign that really fits the bill and should be the "run-away" winner is #33 ...VERY, VERY NICE! (just my $0.02)
http://scosoft.com/s/v/6f15f36e.gif

[Ken]

Hey S'Rex..your little smiley guy is a REAL artist!
lol...Ken

[Replicator]

It's Over !

[njsigns]

Congratulations bladegraphics! Despite my brief whining, I do believe that is one awesome looking sign! I certainly don't mind taking second place to that design at all.

This contest was fun, and exciting to be a part of. Thank you Fred for giving us the assignment, for organizing prizes, and for giving us all a place to come to daily where we can enhance our skills, discuss materials and simply take part in this awesome forum.

I have to say, after being here daily for a couple years, I thought I got to know everyone's style. I was really way off on some of them, some that I thought "that's got to be so and so's design" - nope. I think I only got 4 right, and one of them was mine!

I think everyone should be proud of what they submitted, and congratulate themselves for having the courage to post their work, and to be judged by their peers. Good job everyone! I feel honored to have been a part of this.

Having reviewed all of the entries ...#33 ...VERY, VERY NICE! (just my $0.02)

That's the best prize of all! It makes me feel like I'm doing something right. Thanks Rex!

Gene

[BladeGraphics]

Thanks everyone...It is really an honor receiving so many compliments on my design work, especially coming from the amazingly talented people that contribute to this forum. There was alot of really great work in this contest, and I was actually quite surprised to receive as many votes as I did.

I do apologize about creating a stir regarding the budget constraints...
I figured that the contest rules, as in the past, were fairly flexible.

The design I posted was actually an "up-sell" version of my original design.(Shown)
I was going to post both, but I figured it would split whatever votes I did get, so I went with the fancier version. I guess my theory was right.

Again, Thank You everyone, :thankyou: :U Rock: This was great fun.
-Rich

[skyhigh]

Great project Fred.
I like that "anonymous" part. It was fun trying to guess who did each one. A few were easy, a few were real shockers.

Fantastic work by everyone.

[SignosaurusRex]

Congratulations bladegraphics! You certainly display very fine talent & that sign is a very beautiful piece of artwork.

(quote-NJsigns): "This contest was fun, and exciting to be a part of. Thank you Fred for giving us the assignment, for organizing prizes, and for giving us all a place to come to daily where we can enhance our skills, discuss materials and simply take part in this awesome forum.
I think everyone should be proud of what they submitted, and congratulate themselves for having the courage to post their work, and to be judged by their peers. Good job everyone! I feel honored to have been a part of this." (end quote)

Ditto...Absolutely! I look forward to the next contest. Hopefully more attention will be paid to the set guidelines, by all contestants.
:thankyou: