Vinyl mounting speed contest anyone?

[signsbydale]

I have had a request in a thread here and I discussed this with Fred.

The request was for a speed competition with the Big Squeegee. Granted there would be some that would participate, I think lot more would participate if we open the contest up to use any means of application. This would give us all at signs101 a chance to see how others apply vinyl.

The purpose of this thread is to explore the possibilities and to gain some in site as far as incentives go. We need to get some idea how many would participate and if it should be done in categories. A lot of how we proceed will depend on the willingness of members to video tape their fastest time and share it with us by uploading it to the net and supplying us with the link.

Should we make this a blind competition so that other competitors don't know what they have to beat?

Its your contest folks. What do you want to do?

flood coat a 18X24 coroplast sign
flood coat a 4 x 8 sheet
weed and mount cut vinyl
all the above
any one of the aboveAnyone in for the title "Vinyl King"?

[Sign-Man Signs]

What the hell does "Flood" coat mean?

[Gino]

My only title is still ‘Janitor’, so I’m not looking for any new ones right now…. not to mention all my wife’s titles for me, but they can’t be repeated here.

Sounds like an interesting contest. Not only will it help unify various methods, but it will probably introduce a few new ones to everyone. It would probably become more of a learning video if you compile them all together.

Make sure you get everyone’s waiver to use their shops’ trade secrets……lol

:cool1: Let the games begin...............

[jiarby]

wonder where I can get a video camera !

I am on record for wanting to see people mounting 10+ coro 24x18 prints to see the workflow. Obviously mounting a single one is a breeze, but when I have a stack to get done I always wonder if there is a better way!

I wonder how a Squeegee vs Speed Press race could turn out for a bunch of cut vinyl jobs??

[mystysue]

i jsut mounted a 3ft by 8 ft print on coro.. it went on smooth as can be and took about 10 mins with most of that time being used to line up the print.. Im game.. Dale


for prints.. not for the cut vinyl.. lol.

[Pro Image]

Well send it up the flag pole and see who salutes it............lol

Set it up Dale and I'm in................

[SignosaurusRex]

:thumb:

[Sign-Man Signs]

What the hell does "Flood" coat mean?
Well? how about BIG Squeege? What does flood coat mean? To me a flood coat is what you do to load the ink on a screen.

[signsbydale]

Well? how about BIG Squeege? What does flood coat mean? To me a flood coat is what you do to load the ink on a screen.Welllll, Maybe I used this term wrong...lol
What I meant is to apply the vinyl the full width and length of the sign. What would that be?

[DanStriker]

full coverage

[SignProOhio]

Full Coverage

[Gino]

:Oops: I thought he meant to get out the bottles of fluid out and soak those babies up........:rolleyes:

[jtrube]

Flood coat

I think most of us here knew what you meant

[signsbydale]

wonder where I can get a video camera !

I am on record for wanting to see people mounting 10+ coro 24x18 prints to see the workflow. Obviously mounting a single one is a breeze, but when I have a stack to get done I always wonder if there is a better way!

I wonder how a Squeegee vs Speed Press race could turn out for a bunch of cut vinyl jobs??I thought we could just do one from bare print and sign blank to to finished sign. Doing 10 would get boring and take a lot of time to download for some folks. You could do 10 and select the best time for your entry. I would also like to see an introduction and a brief explanation of the process you are using. We should be able to use the results to help newbies along or scare them way...lol It may also help some of the old timers to see what others are doing and perhaps improve their technique.

Squeegee vs Speed Press race. Who would win? I guess that would remain to be seen. Both processes require different procedures so a contest would have to be such that they start and finish with the same conditions. It would be an interesting race. It could get lengthy with 10 signs. But it may not be a fair race if it is just with one sign. It may take longer with one sign with the Big Squeegee because 10 signs could be masked all at once in a multiple demonstration. Starting the masking takes the most time.

[signsbydale]

It's kind of funny how things are conceived in different parts of the country. I used flood coat because I saw someone else use it that way. Glad we got that cleared up:tongue: Now we can get back to what the thread is all about. I hope:Oops:

[Gino]

Someone should supply everyone with cut vinyl.

That way everyone is starting from the same place.

On your mark, get set, GO......



Weed your little butt off
Tape up whatever you have to using whatever method you want
Roll that vinyl up
Put it down on the substrate
Squeegee away
Get out any remaining bubbles and peel the tape off the end

What time do you have ????????


Tools, methodolgy, secrets, shortcuts, expertise, behind the scenes tools, extra help, munchkins, seeing eye dogs... whatever you need to get the job done.





Here's my tool.... :beer:beer:beer ... I ain't no fool !!

[signsbydale]

Welllll, It don't look like we have enough interest in this contest to proceed with it.

[DARLAK]

Welllll, It don't look like we have enough interest in this contest to proceed with it.

patience grasshopper, you only suggested it yesterday at 6pm and its still the morning...

give people some time to read...

not everybody can be glued to signs 101 24/7

[ChicagoGraphics]

Whats the prize for the fastest time?

[MobileImpact]

Our own little Signs 101 "Vinyl Olympics"! And in some cases Our own little Signs 101 "Special Vinyl Olympics"!

We are qualified for Both!

Kevin

[ecsw]

i'm game

[signsbydale]

Whats the prize for the fastest time?
In the past, Prizes were donated well into the contest. I think this has been a good strategy. I have awarded prizes to the top contenders of past contests even though the contests had nothing to do with my product.

Put forth your best effort and the prizes will reflect your effort.

[GARY CULY]

Vynle Olypics...lmao! Good One
Ill Try The "x-acto Into Finger Stabbing/palm/off-table-to-toe/anywhere -on -body" Division ....guarentee Ill Get A Podium On That!
That Funny Thing Ive Read On Here In A Bit..o Printer Stop Gotta Go!!!

[Sign-Man Signs]

It's kind of funny how things are conceived in different parts of the country. I used flood coat because I saw someone else use it that way. Glad we got that cleared up:tongue: Now we can get back to what the thread is all about. I hope:Oops:

Gee sorry for being so unprofessional and not knowing what flooding a sign means. There's no such thing as a flood stroke when you apply vinyl to a sign. Vinyl isn't liquid is it? So get off your "I'm offended high horse" and get on with the contest. There is no way the Big Squeege will out perform the Speed Press. (Speed Press) Cut, weed, roll, apply. (Big Squeege) Cut, weed, load Big Squuege, apply transfer tape, apply, pull transfer tape off.
I'm sure the Big Squeege is a nice piece, but when I need speed, I used old style application or speed press.
So, if you still want a contest, I'm game. When, where, and how.

[DanStriker]

now we're talking just a general who can get the job done the fastest contest versus a big squeegee contest.

[iSign]

Gee sorry for being so unprofessional and not knowing what flooding a sign means. There's no such thing as a flood stroke when you apply vinyl to a sign. Vinyl isn't liquid is it? So get off your "I'm offended high horse" and get on with the contest. There is no way the Big Squeege will out perform the Speed Press.


christ what a crybaby... are you offended that easy?
you ask a stupid question, and then when you hadn't succedded in derailing the entire conversation to your arrogent nit-picky self important little issue... you ask it again....

...now that the huge misunderstanding :rolleyes: is finally resolved, you got attitude because Dale says "glad we got that cleared up" with a smiley face & then wants to get back to his thread?

You're coming off like a first rate fool in your posts here, so before you dig yourself deeper, you might consider that most folks here can actually read.

When you write "flooding a sign" and then "a flood stroke" ... when that was not what was written, how does that strengthen your little whiney "I'm right, he's wrong" agenda?

...you want to salvage any respect with you haughty macho claims? I nominate you to produce the first video & put your speedpress machismo where your mouth is.... out in public for the judging :rolleyes:

Regardless of your little semantics inquisition, Dale is a sponsor of this site, and his product produces rave reviews from virtually everyone here who has used it.... that should wake up even the most dense of the disbelievers. I credit him for an entirely good natured attempt at bringing some more fun to signs101.

I credit you for more childish, stick-in-the-mud folly... but hey, give us something more to judge here.... otherwise be judged for your words.

[jiarby]

signman...
(Big Squeege) Cut, weed, load Big Squuege, apply transfer tape, apply, pull transfer tape off.


We don't apply transfer tape when using the big squeegee. Maybe a laminate depending on the job, but usually just mount the print naked right onto the substrate.

[signsbydale]

signman...


We don't apply transfer tape when using the big squeegee. Maybe a laminate depending on the job, but usually just mount the print naked right onto the substrate.We don't need to apply transfer tape to prints. We still have to use transfer tape on cut vinyl. I think we are talking about 2 different process here and possibly 2 different catagories for the compitition.

[signsbydale]

Bump

Okay, I guess we need to discuss what handy cap to place on the Speed Press to give it a chance to show in this contest. Any ideas?

Don't want this to be just a contest for the fastest Big Squeegee...lol

[Sign-Man Signs]

christ what a crybaby... are you offended that easy?
No.
you ask a stupid question, and then when you hadn't succedded in derailing the entire conversation to your arrogent nit-picky self important little issue... you ask it again....
No actually I was asking an honest question when he said "Flood a 18 x 24 Coroplast" So anybody that asks a"Stupid Question" and really would like an answer, is arrogant, nit picky, according to you.
My bad.

...now that the huge misunderstanding :rolleyes: is finally resolved, you got attitude because Dale says "glad we got that cleared up" with a smiley face & then wants to get back to his thread?
Adding a smiley face doesn't prove that you weren't trying to be-little someone when asked a question about what you posted trying to cover the fact that you don't know what your talking about.
You're coming off like a first rate fool in your posts here, so before you dig yourself deeper, you might consider that most folks here can actually read.
Most people can read. Some people can read but really don't understand what they are reading, like in your case. Posting thousands of posts does not make you an expert on anything, just says you have a lot of time on your hands to post smart ass replies.

When you write "flooding a sign" and then "a flood stroke" ... when that was not what was written, how does that strengthen your little whiney "I'm right, he's wrong" agenda?
Wasn't trying to prove who was right or wrong, just wanting a clairification of the process presented.
...you want to salvage any respect with you haughty macho claims? I nominate you to produce the first video & put your speedpress machismo where your mouth is.... out in public for the judging :rolleyes:
I don't need to salvage anything. I don't use Dales product and I'm sure it works well for people that haven't gotten the hang of applying transfer tape to CUT VINYL, not prints. Instead of a video tape, let's do it at the Orlando Show. I could cheat on a video, being all haughty macho and all.

Regardless of your little semantics inquisition, Dale is a sponsor of this site, and his product produces rave reviews from virtually everyone here who has used it.... that should wake up even the most dense of the disbelievers. I credit him for an entirely good natured attempt at bringing some more fun to signs101.
Being a dense dis-believer of an item that is supposed to be the best thing since Jesus Christ, I still believe Dales heart was in the right place, and thank him for trying to put together a contest.
I credit you for more childish, stick-in-the-mud folly... but hey, give us something more to judge here.... otherwise be judged for your words.
Thank you for the reply which ment nothing other than to boost your low ego. By the way, ever used a Speed Press? If you had, you would know your fighting a losing battle. But that's just me again, whinning, arrogant, crying, macho, dense, childish, stick in the mud, and oh, yea stupid. Thanks for all the names. "Otherwise be judged by your words". Great quote!
Now go away ,you bore me...............
:Sleeping:

[SignosaurusRex]

..."We now return to the regular scheduled programing"....I've got a little gold squeegee thats jumping up and down for some additional hot attention. I'm always up for a game or two!:Big Laugh

[signsbydale]

I'm thinking about putting up a $1500 grand prize.

I'm also thinking that it should be like a triathalon consisting of 3 signs.

weeding to mounting a cut vinyl sign (18 X 24)
mounting a full coverage print or colored vinyl on coroplast (18 X 24)
mount cut vinyl on a 3' X 8' banner. Finishing with grommets not required


I think these are the most common signs that are made in sign shops and will give everyone a chance to see how they can improve their operation.

This should give us about a 5-10 minute video

[maxxgraphix]

All the above.
4 x 8 coro flood or cut in under 2 minutes.
18 x 24's in 30 seconds.

No I don't use the Big Squigee or any squigee

[jeroen]

someone should post a design that all competitors have to use
that'll make things more equal

[signsbydale]

someone should post a design that all competitors have to use
that'll make things more equalThat is what this tread is all about. Let's get organized!:signs101:

[Gino]

I don't think the sizes you are requiring are large enough to get accurate times. There will be so many that are almost the same time, that you'll either have a group tie or have to take this thing down to the 100th of a second for your results. Doing that would knock out the honor system of doing this. I believe you would need a more controlled process or environment for what you're presenting here.

[Sign-Man Signs]

I don't think the sizes you are requiring are large enough to get accurate times. There will be so many that are almost the same time, that you'll either have a group tie or have to take this thing down to the 100th of a second for your results. Doing that would knock out the honor system of doing this. I believe you would need a more controlled process or environment for what you're presenting here.

Good suggestion Gino. Dale, I'd save the $1500.00. Just may add a level of ,well let's say, not by the rules type of contest. I would suggest we keep it simple. Do your own video, with clock in back bround and maybe just do 4 or 5 18 x 24's already weeded. After your video at least you can reclaim the coroplast.

On a personal note: I would like apologize for any distrbance I have caused on this link and hope my actions don't kill the idea. I really just wanted to know what flooding a vinyl sign ment since I never heard the term.
:smile:

[iSign]

Here's a thought Dale,

Solicit your signs101 fans to contribute impressive speed demonstration videos to be supplied with good lighting, (& no cussing :rolleyes:) for the dual purpose of:


showing off to our signs101 buddies, who may then be compelled by the early entries to "compete" by supplying later entries

competing to provide you with the most valuable promotional tool that would, by acceptance of the offer to compete, imply full release of rights to you for your future promotional use.


In this way, what you get out of it is hopefully some reusable promotional material, for which a first, second and third prize might be justified, & worthwhile for you.

What we get out of it is a simplified set of rules (make the video an impressive demo of the big squeegee, & make it functional for Dale's promotional use) ...and a chance to show off to our peers... and a possible shot at a prize for the most valuable promotional video for our sponsor.


Note that once a video is submitted, I'd encourage it to be posted immediately, & each "speed demo" should outline the parameters, so for example, if I see Fred with a jig already set up, 2 dozen 18x24 panels & a stack of laminated prints when he starts the clock... & then 38 minutes later he has a stack of product ready to go out the door....

I may have felt previously uninspired by the "contest" untill I am now driven to see if I can do the same thing in 37 minutes.

Maybe I do it in 39, but with a better camera angle, better lighting... I may be up for consideration of a prize... but nobody has to split hairs on quality, or if some 2 minute irregularity skewed the playing field in someone's favor.

I will commit to entering one video of some sort if this idea moves forward.

[signsbydale]

I realize that there my be some that will attempt to cheat as much as they think they can get by with. How would we know if a design in a design contest really belongs to the contributor? Cheating hurts everyone but the one that gets hurt the most is the one that has to live with the idea that he cheated. Is it truely a victory if one cheats?

I think it would be obvious if the frames get a little jerky or the movement is too fast. If we had some that close we could do a play off.

From the looks of it, it don't look like this will be a contest that will show the fastest application. It will be more who can think up the fastest preparation.

I think we should withhold the times until all the entries have been summited with a penalty of being disqualified for advertising it. in this way we can't use someone else's technique to create a better time. It will also encourage participants to do their best.

We should restrict the contestants to subscribers to signs101.

[DanStriker]

so for clarification is this a big squeegee contest or who can make the signs the quickest regardless of method?

my opinion is it should be the quickest regardless of method, if the big squeegee is the fastest you will have material for advertising showing the benefits in real life.

regardless people will see a variety of methods and for those that only know one method of application they will be exposed to many.

[signsbydale]

so for clarification is this a big squeegee contest or who can make the signs the quickest regardless of method?

my opinion is it should be the quickest regardless of method, if the big squeegee is the fastest you will have material for advertising showing the benefits in real life.

regardless people will see a variety of methods and for those that only know one method of application they will be exposed to many.Well said!

The rights for publishing should remain with the author. If I use their video in my advertising it is only right for me to pay them or at least get their permission. I'm not trying to get my moneys worth out of it so much as giving everyone a chance to see what others are doing. For all I know, it could hurt me more than help. There are a lot of unknowns to deal with here.

[DanStriker]

now I'd love to win $1500 cachingo's baby :) but I think that in the rules it should be Hand Methods only meaning no automated machinery...but of course it could be awesome for you to see the big squeegee blow the socks off of automated equipment.

[Sign-Man Signs]

Were should we send video? Youtube? Something like that?

[signsbydale]

Upload to the net and send the link to...not yet determined 3rd party.

[jiarby]

You Tube... Then Dale can embed the video on his site! :-)

[signsbydale]

You Tube works but I thought I would give everyone their choice. They may want to keep it in their own site. It is harder to make copies from You Tube if that is the way you want to go.

The ones in my site were copied from Isign's web site so that Doug did not have to use up his mb's with everyone downloading it.

[signsbydale]

...I think that in the rules it should be Hand Methods only meaning no automated machinery...but of course it could be awesome for you to see the big squeegee blow the socks off of automated equipment.Good point. I don't think there are any machines that could win on the mounting of a single sign. Do you know of any that will mount at 18 inches or more per second?

[DanStriker]

Good point. I don't think there are any machines the could win on the mounting of a single sign. Do you know of any that will mount at 18 inches or more per second?

maybe not 18" per second but about 3 seconds yes....

[signsbydale]

maybe not 18" per second but about 3 seconds yes....There may be some that go about a third tht size but I can't picture loading them with a graphic and coro as fast as it can be done with a jig and tape.

The rebel sign I show in my DVD is 43" wide and applied at the rate of 18 linear inches per second. That works out to 5 3/8 square foot per second.

The Rebel sign was one of the first big graphics that I filmed. I was going a little slow so observers could see what was happening. With some vinyls it may be possible to go almost twice that fast.

[signsbydale]

I don't think the sizes you are requiring are large enough to get accurate times. There will be so many that are almost the same time, that you'll either have a group tie or have to take this thing down to the 100th of a second for your results. Doing that would knock out the honor system of doing this. I believe you would need a more controlled process or environment for what you're presenting here.You have some good points here Gino. Can you give some suggestions? What combination of signs would be enough to get some accurate times? YouTube is limited to 10 minutes. Repetitive signs are not fun to watch.

[signsbydale]

Should we add a 4X8 sign to the list?

[signsbydale]

Contest consists of 3 signs.

weed and mount a coroplast yard sign (18" X 24")
mount lettering on a 3' X 8' banner. pre-masked and ready to mount.
print on 4' X 8' sheet full coverage start side by side with no prep. Sheet may be jigged up.


Must have an introduction and an explanation of the processes you will be using. State what brand of vinyl and transfer paper you are using.

Must have adaquite lighting so that bubbles can be seen. Finished sign must be free of bubbles and wrinkles to qualify.

Time gets multiplied by the number of people needed for each sign. If 2 people are used on the print then the time is doubled for that sign. An electric motor quailifies as a person for this contest.

You can use anything at your disposal as long as it is legal. No copyright or patent infringements. The brand of vinyl is up to you.

In the event of a tie, and it can't be determind that one is better than the other, the prizes will be split.

Designs & dimentions for cut vinyl to be used will be supplied. Prints may be substituted with plain white or colored vinyl.Each process will be timed individually.

Prize money will be based on number of participants. Minumum 5 and $50 for each participant with a cap of $1500. Videos Must be uploaded to you tube and the link sent to Fred(??) for publishing. Times will not be revealed or the links published until the end of the contest. It would be advisable to wait to upload the video until a few days before the end of the contest.

Does this look good to everyone?
Did I leave out anything?

[Gino]

Sorry Dale…. didn’t notice your request until now. I don’t want to control your game…. then I wouldn’t be allowed to enter.

What you have looks rather fair. Here are are a few things I noticed.

I don’t think a plain piece of vinyl will substitute well for a printed piece though. Once most vinyls are printed on, they take on a new direction when applying the piece. They are softer and more open to problems, I guess due to the ink or chemical reaction to the vinyl. Virgin vinyl, so to speak, will be much easier to work with when putting down a full sheet.

The only thing I see a little unfair is that the amount of words, type style and other small incidentals will all play a part in transferring one to the other regardless of the method being used. I believe the same type vinyl, the same words, the same layout should be used across the board to make a fair playing field…. otherwise you’re open to fouls on account of certain things [tricks] being used out of your control.

Same deal with the banner… same print or cut vinyl should be used on all 3’ x 8’ banners of a certain weight.

A 4’ x 8’ digital print might be different to put down if it was printed on cast, calendered or true digital media.

Without your control over the substrates and medias…. the end results might be untrue. You’ll have to create so many categories the contest might lose enthusiasm.

[mark in tx]

How about accuracy of layout as a another measure of the contest?

Anyone can lay a banner with cut vinyl in about 2 minutes, not including peeling transfer tape, but it sure won't have straight lines!

[signsbydale]

... The only thing I see a little unfair is that the amount of words, type style and other small incidentals will all play a part in transferring one to the other regardless of the method being used. I believe the same type vinyl, the same words, the same layout should be used across the board to make a fair playing field…. otherwise you’re open to fouls on account of certain things [tricks] being used out of your control.

Same deal with the banner… same print or cut vinyl should be used on all 3’ x 8’ banners of a certain weight.As mentioned, the designs would be supplied with dimensions for the cut vinyl.

knowledge of materials is part of the contest. Everyone has the same chance to choose what they are working with. There is lesson on speed for different mterials that needs to be addressed by everyone. The plain unprinted vinyl is for those that do not have a printer. If you feel that the plain is faster, by all means use the plain stuff.

Mark in tx...Accuracy of layout may be used in case of a tie. As stated, the banner will be ready to mount. You can align it before your time starts. Time starts on the beginning of the first stroke and ends with the end of last stroke. Removal of transfer tape will not be counted. For the sake of speed, a second person can help with tape removal. The tape must be remove so that we can see the finished job. No break in filming.

I'm trying to keep this down to under 10 minutes of video.

[signsbydale]

If someone would like to contribute a design for all to use, please let us know! Any suggestions?

[signsbydale]

Is this a good time to start the contest?
How long should we run it? 1, 2, 3, 4 weeks???