What profiling equipment do we need?

[ColesCreations]

Setup: Mimaki JV3 160SP, 6 color + white, FlexiSign Pro 7.6.2

Have been playing with different profiles without getting close to correct colors, have decided that some tool is needed, not sure which!!!

Anyway, e-Bay has some Eye-0ne packages, some including eye-one pro or different models of spectrophotometer (way too difficult word).
Also, x-rite DTP32R is listed in the FlexiSign list of equipment.

Does this mean that, if I get one of these, plug it into the PC, then FS has the needed software to make or modify an existing icc-profile?

And- if we find a profile that is close- is it possible to modify it permanently?

I do understand this will take some time to figure out, but as of now, we are able to hit some spot colors and get decent prints, but need to be able to print photos with decent colors also...

Our budget is a bit blown right now, $1k now a pretty firm limit on equipment.

I have heard there are services where you can send in a specified printout, then they will send a profile back to you, not sure if that's for us, any thoughts?

Thanks!

[ChicagoGraphics]

The best way to go about it, is to save more money and buy some good rip software along with a good colour management software with a spectromitor.
To have 1 profile made by a professional will cost you a grand, they may have come down in price some sense the begining.

[ColesCreations]

Thanks for reply!
So- Good rip software- We have Flexisign, other people claim it's good, hope it's up to the task?
Color management- Is the Flexisign built-in software sufficient?
And- what hardware is recommended?
1 k for a profile may be worth it, but I'd like to be able to do it in-house, just like everything else...Is it a curse?

[Matt Cuellar]

Flexi's decent for custom profile generation, well at least in my opinion. If you want to do it right (again, just an opinion), I'd look into a version of Wasatch or Onyx RIP which will give you far more color management tools along with an i1 Proof system that has a custom ICC profiling software package built in.

Definitely check eBay or Amazon has good deals too, but make sure you have some resources to fall back on when you start profiling. People here are a good start, but accurate profiling takes a lot of patience and understanding, so don't expect things to be smooth right outside of the box. I've been creating custom ICC's for 3 years and I still am learning! Good luck! :smile:

[Bob Price]

The Gretag Macbeth Eye One Pro is one spectro that will fit into your budget, and it is supported directly by Flexi 7.x.

The base version that will create complete profiles (in Flexi) is Eye One Proof, at a retail cost of under $1000 US. Higher level versions of the Eye One packages will do more, and include more Gretag software, albeit at a higher price.

Bob

[Bob Price]

Oops, that should read Eye One Design at the $1k price point.

Bob

[GXSignCo]

I got my I1 proof of ebay for just under $1200.

[customsticker]

I built all of the profiles for my printers through flexi and an eye one. Very easy to do once you understand the main concepts.

It's definitely not rocket science.

[Correct Color]

To have 1 profile made by a professional will cost you a grand, they may have come down in price some sense the begining.

That certainly isn't true. It's almost impossible to do all the steps necessary to get a good profile from a RIP long distance, but in my daily rate I figure five profiles a day, and I have yet to get five grand a day. Not that I can recall I've ever asked. I'd quote my well-south of five-grand a day daily rate here, but I don't want to offend this guy again.

In answer to your specific questions:

Yes, if you buy an Eye-One Pro, you can plug it into your PC running Flexi-Signs 7.62 and make valid media complete with linearizations and ink limits and ICC profiles. Not so with the DTP32 which is only a densitometer and will only do linearizations, not ICC profiles.

However, the profile-making engine in Flexi isn't the best out there, and valid ICC profiles don't necessarily equate to good ICC profiles. To do the job right, you need at least an Eye-One Pro, and either GMB Profile-Maker Pro or Monaco Profiler.

[ColesCreations]

Very good info, as mentioned, we're not looking for rocket science, icc-profiling for idiots is more in our league...
Will start looking for eye-one pro, and go from there.
Thanks!

[eforer]

Oops, that should read Eye One Design at the $1k price point.

Bob


Eye-one design would not be the hot setup, proof would be the way to go. FLexi's builtin profiling tool is alright, and it supports a reasonable range of hardware. Here's the old color profiler manual: http://www.interstateelectric.com/Uploads/Color%20Profiler%20Manual.pdf it has info about all the supported hardware, if you buy something older, make sure it can do ICC charts and linearization charts, some of the older meters only do one or the other.

[GXSignCo]

Eye-one design would not be the hot setup, proof would be the way to go...

Agreed, in fact, I'd go so far to say that it is a total WASTE as you must have the PROOF edition or better.

[KR3signguy]

http://www.inkjetcolorsystems.com/xrite_the_pulse_color_spectrophotometer%20and%20co lor%20management.htm
http://www.colourtools.co.uk/monprofilerplat.htm

[signguy95]

I have talked with a supplier about coming out and profiling our printer. They are located 2 hours east of us and will be coming out to profile the 4 different medias that we use. Cost = around $400.

Guy said we could purchase the Eye - One for around $1000 + $400 for training, but if he came out and did our profiling, he would show me how to do it, then when I decided to I could just buy the equipment and not need training! SWEET! Also, they offer tech support if I ended up needing some help!


Jay

[Bob Price]

Eye One Design is all that is needed for generating profiles completely inside of Flexi's Profiling Module. Ink limits, linearization, total ink, and characterization can all be built inside of this module.

I would (and did) recommend the Proof product (for the EyeOne Match software) for building the characterization (ICC) component, but it is a inaccurate to state that the Design version is a WASTE to get started with custom profiling using Flexi.

By the way, you can also upgrade from Design to Proof by paying the roughly $500 retail difference between the Design and Proof products.

Bob

[eforer]

If you intend to use the flexi profiler and not the software included with the eye-one design, that package would be okay as the hardware is all the same, but the software tools in the eye one design package are useless.

[ColesCreations]

oops

[ColesCreations]

Update:
Used the CD and loaded all the profiles from FlexiSign.
Started using random profiles, printed on Oracal 651. Set Media as Elite White Vinyl, ICC to Elite HQ720 also. Colors are now OK-so-so...
Stuck some heavy banner material in the machine, and figured that since Elite worked for Oracal, why not for "Inexpensive heavy banner for solvent and ecosolvent print"?
Set media to Elite banner, profile to Elite Glossy HQ 720 CMYKlclm and printed grat-looking photos! Go figure... (The greys in the picture had a tad too much magenta in them, but we'll get by for now.

Thanks to all of you for providing insight! Will definitely get Eye-one!

I don't know of anyone locally who may be able to help out, we have the only solvent printer w/in 10 miles:-)