Proofs

[p3]

I do a lot of offset printing and was wondering what a decent printer to have at home would be to show proofs of what it would look like before it is sent out. Also, do magazine ads and things like that so I would need to be able to print 13x18 or so. Any input?
Thanks!

[Replicator]

Epson or HP Photo Printers . . .

[Mosh]

Konika-Minolta color laser here, prints 11x17 paper fairly close color wise.

[Rodi]

How critical?

[wes70]

Are you looking for photographic quality? Pigment or dye ink?

[p3]

Pigment I believe. I'm not exactly sure. I just want something thats going to look close to right on color wise. The one i'm using now if there is a lot of dark colors they bleed together and make it hard to see....

[Salmoneye]

I have an A3+ Canon printer and I find it hard to beat for speed, noise and output quality.

[Jester1167]

If you colors are ok on the printer you have now, invest in better paper. Soggy paper and bleeding ink are signs that you need better paper.

[royster13]

So you are looking for a desktop printer that uses toner or dye to duplicate an offset press that uses ink?......I have seen many proofs over the years and while proofs are good for checking content, layout, etc. they certainly are not an exact science when being used to check colour.....Good luck......

[G-Artist]

Any proof press can be calibrated to equal the outcome from an offset or web printer. Not cheap to do given all the instrumentation and time you will need, but the results will be pretty close to dead-on.

There will be variables but that will lie in the realm of the press operater as to how he tweaks the press run unlike setting up calibration for a digital printer.

[beermonster]

check how the presses are run - are they run to a STANDARD like swop, or euroscale or whatever - you can get a reasonable "proof" by running your printer to the same standard

if however, like me, we have profiled our presses and have our own icc profile for the press - you could possibly ask for that icc profile and tag your files with that and print and see how that looks

since i work in prepress i get a lot of desighners send me "proofs" that are meaningless - run to whatever profiles they "feel" like tagging on - when my proof (calibrated via icc profile to my presses) doesn't match THEIR "proof" then there always seems to be "something wrong with MY set up...."

go figure......

then of course there's the non accurate proofs supplied with a job and we have to "match" them on press......this kind of ignorance has hindered this sadly deskilled trade for years now

[Rodi]

What RIP are you using?

It is pretty funny that designers are trying to force a press to match their desktop printer! Then when they buy a new printer, what happens, right? hahaha. What designer should be doing is make their printer act like a press… not the press act like a desktop printer. It just shows what rank amateurs they are!

[beermonster]

it is funny (press minders seldom laugh at that though!)

we always manage, and to be honest unless a desighner wants to go as far as profiling substrates and varnish finishes to like FOGRA standards or GRACOL etc etc then most "proofs" (even mine sometimes) and just reasonable guides. we print on brownline chipboard and no matter where you look there is NO standard for that - ICC, CIE, nowhere, so proofing is speculative in my trade

i digress however, i'm in litho print and have a UV inkjet for some flat foamex boards we do - hence me being here to soak up info from you guys :)

[Rodi]

Dot Gain!

[beermonster]

we have a winner............

[Rodi]

Why can't the printed piece hit the same hilight as my Epson proof, I used uncoated stock (barrel of Laughter!)

[Jim Doggett]

...most "proofs" (even mine sometimes) and just reasonable guides.

Agreed. The days of spending gobs on prepress are over, except for the real high-end work/buyers. I haven't seen hard copy for years ... until it's off the press. Proofing is done online, via PDF ... and my monitor ain't press-matched.

Cheap / fast trumps exacting color, it seems, at least in the Web offset realm.

My $0.02,

Jim

[beermonster]

i may have to kill you now :)

[beermonster]

oo sorry that was for rodi :)

here in packaging land we still do hard proofs - full mock ups (see my post somewhere about trying to get my UV inkjet to run colour accurate-ish proofs onto board substrate) as we have lots of marry-ups in desighns, and customers WILL spend more time and check a made up colour mock up than a pdf - a pdf "yeah looks ok" - then it goes wrong as they didnt read the 6pt w/o type on the 4 col black background.....which was bitmapped anyway coz the pdf compressed the MASSIVE file the desighner sent in so we could email a pdf proof to some 25 yr old monitor thats about as colour correct as a b&w movie......

neh - i'm ranting now - gonna get meself a banning at this rate!

[Rodi]

Another threat on my existence… what bad customer service! You know on my monitor I got such a nice brite flourescent color and while I could not match it on my old desktop, I figured, you have an expensive machine that would, and now my whole marketing campaign is in a shambles. What? No I didn't want to spend extra on a real proof, jeeze I didn't even take the time to run you content hardcopy or laser separations… that's your job.


Do I fit the noose now? HAHAHA

(btw, those are words said to me in the course of my career, no embelishment, but slightly put together!)

[beermonster]

you sir - may now be killed yes :)

well my work here is done - thats this thread shot to sh¶t and truely threadjacked :)

ps: i like the "we prefer to design in rgb as we like the colours....oh - whats cmyk then?"

at THIS point i turn into a crazed killer

[Rodi]

The OP he wants what is very difficult, a dead match on a desktop device.

Seriously, get a good Epson proofer, Check out CGS

http://www.cgsusa.com/

[beermonster]

yeah cgs, efi or oris colour tuner - prolly the three best colour management rips for offset proofing etc etc - if that makes sense lol

even something like the reasonably priced epson stylus pro 4880 with a good rip will give good colour

however you will never precisely match whatever eventual output device is used, but accept that and you have a good choice of machines and rips
:signs101:

[beermonster]

apologies - cgs is oris - i meant to add gmg