Ink peeling off dibond when laminated

[T-Square_WPB]

I've run into an issue. We have printed direct on dibond using an Arizona 250, then laminated with a 3 mil gloss laminate. Now the laminate is peeling away and taking the ink right off the dibond. Has anyone had this issue? Or have experience with laminating direct print?

[Fatboy]

dID YOU ALLOW THE PRINTS TO STAND FOR 24 HRS TO UN GASS/ tHAT COULD BE IT!

[T-Square_WPB]

No, I believe they were laminated within an hour of being printed. Good point. Even though they are a direct print an UV cured, they may need to stand for 24 hours???

[Gino]

Is it 100% coverage out to the edge ??

[T-Square_WPB]

Yes, 100% coverage.

[Gino]

I'm not sure what is peeling back the laminate, but you seem to have an adhesion problem, also.

[T-Square_WPB]

I agree. Thinking since we laminate with heat as opposed to cold, that the heat may be getting the surface of the dibond so hot the UV cured ink loses it's grip!

[ddarlak]

are you using dibond or the latest and greatest china version? i have had ronan background enamel peel off and leave no trace of ever being on the new cheap china alternative. they must have some trace of oil on them.

[jdigital]

actually, since it's covered 100%, the laminate has only the ink to stick to. It's not a waiting issue, it just happens. Dibond is not a porous material so the ink will stick to the adhesive backer of the overlam rather than the surface of Dibond. We've had similar issues with our UV printers. My suggestion would be to paint a gloss over the print or leave a white border around the print so the overlam will then stick to the dibond.

-or-

You can buy the Inca Onset which prints gloss, if you carry a few million in your pocket. lol

[SignManiac]

I direct print to DiBond and OmegaBond, a Chinese knock off, regularly, but will only use two part UV automotive clear coat on anything that I want to last. I'm not a big fan of vinyl based laminates for anything other than a digital prints.

[T-Square_WPB]

I think we are going to try an Auqeous lam next. If that doesn't work maybe just go buy some clear coat at my local auto parts store!!

[johnnysigns]

Outgassing w/ the UV inks shouldn't be an issue.

Is the laminate shrinking? If there's poor adhesion on the Dibond to begin with once it lifts it's adios. You try flashing the Dibond w/ a flame before printing? It's sort of like a ghetto chroma treatment and works well when we're in a pinch w/ some acrylics or aluminum.

[Malkin]

If it's peeling up due to shrinking laminate, then you could try switching to a cast instead. Though I think the better answer is some sort of clear automotive finish or similar.

[DoubleDown]

Nope, it's peeling due to the surface of the dibond or metal in correlation to the adhesion of the inks on the surface. pretty sure if you look in your UV manual, it will tell you that aluminum, acrylics, and some plastics are low tension materials and will need some sort of primer ahead of time for the ink to adhere to. You can get these primers from places like fuji or triangle ink. In addition, you can lay down a clear coat of laminate first and then print to the board and you should be good to go. You can also lay down a sheet of clear vinyl first but that kinda defeats the purposes.

Rule of thumb is if you can scratch the uv ink of with something sharp, then it needs to get better adhesion, primer, etc.

To cheat the sytem you can always run the laminate 2" wider than the print and wrap the laminate around the board so the edges don't come up.

[DoubleDown]

Also, uv does need to "cure"...there's bad information about these printers in that they are dry to touch so they are ready to go. Not true at all, they still need 24-48 to gain full adhesion to whatever material they are on. But even though the manufacturers tell you this, everyone will still get the stuff out the door asap and not worry about what really needs to be done and teach your customers the right way...not the fast or "the way the guy does it across town"