Panels Not Lining Up On Dance Floors

[uh-niece]

Been having this issue for a while and I don't know what my next step is in terms of fixing this issue. We have 2 printers. VG2-640 and VG3-540 and both of them print cleanly and nicely. The problems we run into are the large/long prints for walls and dance floors. I've tried everything I know so far in combatting this issue but I need some more opinions and help on what to do next to help make this easier on my installers. My research has brought me here and all the info I know is below. Hoping someone can help shed some light on this for me. Have read through the forums and elsewhere and I have tried all the other suggestions in other threads (Diff install technique, different vinyls, squeegee methods, making sure panels line up before hand etc etc). I've attached photos of the recent job we did.

Here's my vinyl used and settings:
Vinyl used: GF221 - 6mil
No lamination
VersaWorks - Alternate every panel selected
Overlap: 1.5in - 2in.

Due to the turn around time: The vinyl gets roughly 18-30 hours of de-gas time most of the time.

What are my next options in trying to fix this?
- Should I try to use 12mil vinyl? Specifically looking at Fellers Black Label 12 Mil Floor, Street And Wall Film
- Should I invest in a lamination machine? The lamination's added benefit of making the vinyl more resistant to scratches during installation and making it safer to dance would be an added benefit. Will the lamination really help me in the stretch problem?

 

[ddarlak]

Weight of the rolls makes some prints longer or shorter. If roll is brand new the prints tend to be shorter, end of roll prints tend to be longer. Best thing you can try is make smaller panels.

 

[uh-niece]

Weight of the rolls makes some prints longer or shorter. If roll is brand new the prints tend to be shorter, end of roll prints tend to be longer. Best thing you can try is make smaller panels.

Is there any feed calibration I can do to combat this?
On a 24x24 dance floor I print 7 panels at 24ft long each. I tried printing shorter panels 1-2 times years ago and the installers told me it was even more difficult to line up everything on a dance floor. They had close to 14-16 panels when trying the shorter panel method.

 

[CanuckSigns]

Weight of the rolls makes some prints longer or shorter. If roll is brand new the prints tend to be shorter, end of roll prints tend to be longer. Best thing you can try is make smaller panels.

Is this still an issue on printers where the media is loaded on a motorized spindle? I know our old rolands the media just sat on 2 bars and the weight of the roll affected how much the feed motors had to work. But on our epsons, the media is on a motorized spindle, which a assume solve this issue.

 

[victor bogdanov]

Problem most likely due to printer, 6 mil shouldn't stretch and if it did and each panel is applied with the same technique they will stretch uniformly and still match up.

Remember the roland spec on feed length is +/- a certain %. even a +/- .5% over 16 ft will be significant

i do wholesale dance floor printing, printed on Canon Colorado for perfect panel length, everything matches perfectly. PM me for more info



They have the actual % listed for each model somewhere

 

[victor bogdanov]

But the images you posted it looks like they just did not overlap correctly? Does everything line up before application? (to eliminate material stretching as a possibility). But to me from your images looks like they did not overlap correcty

 

[ikarasu]

It looks to me like the vinyl was applied at an angle.... Measure how much overlap isn at the top, then measure the bottom... Are they the same?

We use 1" bleed, that way we can just lay a strip of 1" green tape over the panel and use it for alignment to make sure it's being applied perfectly straight... Takes the guesswork out of it.

 

[Texas_Signmaker]

Your installers suck. You can tell it's not a print issue because the panels are too far off sideways. First of all, line the prints up in shop and use masking tape to register, that way you know the prints are right before leaving the shop. The last thing I want to do onsite is struggle to figure out where the prints line up when your on a scaffold or ladder trying to tape it up.

Second problem is your installers don't know what they're doing. I'm adjusting and correcting as soon as the art is even 1/32nd off. If you get to where your 1/4 off you cant recover from that easily. As you apply the print, you need to actively make the panels line up and deal with the resulting wrinkles and trapped air.

Also, make it easier on yourself. Use a laser level, use scaffolding instead of ladders. Get a helper to assist. Easier you make it the better the end result will be.

All this can help but the biggest thing is, are your installers properly trained and have enough experience? It took a few years and A LOT of wraps for me to get good. It took learning from people that knew how to do it right. So many sign companies don't have properly trained or experience installers. That's why when I sub out I only pick 3M certified wrappers and insist that's who they send out to do my install. You might look into those classes because I hardly ever have issues with 3M certified installers.

 

[Jharris81]

I agree that they look like they are not over lapping properly. The other thing is if you lay them out on the floor and line everything up where it needs to be aligned and then you will know if it’s a printer issue or an install issue.

 

[uh-niece]

Thank you all for the help, I will work through these suggestions and hopefully have some updates down the line.

My initial thoughts are that the panel lengths are too long for the installers to deal with causing the installs to skew.

 

[Texas_Signmaker]

Thank you all for the help, I will work through these suggestions and hopefully have some updates down the line.

My initial thoughts are that the panel lengths are too long for the installers to deal with causing the installs to skew.

How long are they?

 

[uh-niece]

How long are they?

depends on the floor size. Each panels can be anywhere from 18ft long to 30ft long

 

[Texas_Signmaker]

That's pretty long, you have to have some really good installers to handle that. I don't think I would attempt to do 30 feet