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Is there any one man shop making around 500k$ in annual sayles
- Thread starter bigben
- Start date
bigben
Not a newbie
95% of our products are roll-to-roll prints that we produce in-house. All the install are sub-out. We are expanding with new capability (upgrading all our machines) but mainly with a whole new market/customer base that just opened for us.
White Haus
Not a Newbie
We've come real close to 500k in sales a few years with 2-4 people but have taken a hit over the last couple of years.
Shooting to be back on track to those numbers by next year with 3 people total.
Shooting to be back on track to those numbers by next year with 3 people total.
Christian @ 2CT Media
Active Member
When we broke a million we were a 4 man shop.
Notarealsignguy
Arial - it's almost helvetica
The clerical part of 500k with 2 people would be the hard part. I feel like 150-200/head, depending on your sales mix, would be comfortable.
bigben
Not a newbie
That is very impressive.
Right now, I'm the only one making the production and we are making a bit more than 300k$/year. With the new equipment, we will open a new market and considerably speeding the production.
Christian @ 2CT Media
Active Member
What is your main product line? Do you know your margins?
Also, have you examined where your pain points and bottlenecks are?
Also, have you examined where your pain points and bottlenecks are?
bigben
Not a newbie
Our main business is wallpaper and we make a decent margin on them. But with the new equipment, we will be able to open a hole new segment and speeding our current process. I'm pretty good with tracking the number to calculate the final margin (I also time myself on each job) and evaluating what work and not.
Last year, we made a business cleanup by firing some customers, keeping less material variant, raising our prices, etc.
balstestrat
Problem Solver
Did you already decide what machinery your going to invest to? I know you have been talking about it.
bigben
Not a newbie
Yes. The order have not been placed yet because we are looking for a new location. But our list right now is 2X HP W800, Kala mistral 1650, a summa s2 with tangential knife and currently evaluation some possibility for a XY cutter (checking for a Chinese brand) and flatbed application table (probably a CWT).
CanuckSigns
Active Member
We are over 500K with 2 full time employees, a semi-retired employee who comes in and lends a hand when needed, and a few outsourced installers.
Notarealsignguy
Arial - it's almost helvetica
Maybe I am bad at business but there seems to be a law of diminishing returns as you add head count. 300k isnt a tough number to do by yourself but add a second person, non-owner non-spouse and it is highly unlikely that you will hit 600k. Another thing to consider is how new additions can sometimes erode your margins depending on what it is. Some things make money and some things pay the bills.
Notarealsignguy
Arial - it's almost helvetica
Well we know who the half is
FireSprint.com
Trade Only Screen & Digital Sign Printing
I see most shops in the sign and print industry being in $150-$250k per employee. 500k for a one man shop would be impressive.
Lots of automation and outsourcing I would imagine, or a small number of very large artistic products that require lots of contractors maybe?
Lots of automation and outsourcing I would imagine, or a small number of very large artistic products that require lots of contractors maybe?
I'm guessing you guys are talking in gross sales... not profit?
It'd be interesting to know how much profit, or roughly how much based on business size.... for instance you 2 people shops that make 500k... whats your take home? 2-300k? and those of you with 10 employees making a million... Whats your take home?
We're a company of 20ish. We just broke a million in 1 month in sales... Mainly because a bunch of our big projects got delayed due to product delay, so a bunch of our big jobs went out last month instead of the month before. I dont get why they celebrated... Especially when I found out a bunch of it was distributed products that theres not much profit on.
It seems to me take home is the true way to see whether adding employees is worth it. If you have 5 employees at 50k a year and increase your revenue by a million a year (Doubtful), But have to purchase more machines to handle the load and end up taking home an extra 10-20% more than you did last year... is it worth the headache of managing 5 employees?
I remember a thread awhile ago where most people who decided to "go big" and went from a 1-2 man shop to a 5-10 man shop regretted it and said the stress wasnt worth the tiny bit of extra profit they're making. I'm not saying dont ever expand...Just make sure it's worth it!
It'd be interesting to know how much profit, or roughly how much based on business size.... for instance you 2 people shops that make 500k... whats your take home? 2-300k? and those of you with 10 employees making a million... Whats your take home?
We're a company of 20ish. We just broke a million in 1 month in sales... Mainly because a bunch of our big projects got delayed due to product delay, so a bunch of our big jobs went out last month instead of the month before. I dont get why they celebrated... Especially when I found out a bunch of it was distributed products that theres not much profit on.
It seems to me take home is the true way to see whether adding employees is worth it. If you have 5 employees at 50k a year and increase your revenue by a million a year (Doubtful), But have to purchase more machines to handle the load and end up taking home an extra 10-20% more than you did last year... is it worth the headache of managing 5 employees?
I remember a thread awhile ago where most people who decided to "go big" and went from a 1-2 man shop to a 5-10 man shop regretted it and said the stress wasnt worth the tiny bit of extra profit they're making. I'm not saying dont ever expand...Just make sure it's worth it!
Mighty big and damm near a loaded question.
To produce at this level, first and foremost, you have to know your 'sh T
You have to know your Outsourcing Companies and are intimate with their work flow and scheduling.
In your own shop your time is Money, you are not skimping on materials either.
You get a roll of carppy vinyl or you have received yet another roll of mis marked
transfer tape ,,,,,,, Are you F N Kidding me?
Lemme tell ya, The cheapest vinyls in your shop are 3m Intermediates and
1005 or 180. My lams are Luster 8509 and 8519.
You have Zero time for errors and 3m SC50 series weeds out beautifully
and the IJ35c-10 is unreal when you go to weed out.
I have bought them all, tried them all dozens of times and 3m is the most consistant
Your Transfer tape Is Transferrite 6782 Ultra This is the near equivalent to 3m scps-2.
I have zero problems with this tape and when you just spent 30 minutes on a weed out
and you have a mis marked roll of Carp Tape. and that sheet just hit the trash can.
Yeah there went your $20 savings.. Skrew that
6782 is $100 a roll and it performs well with the cv3 liners, the peliminary lay down
(ironing the sheets) is clean and just hit it with the squeeg or just pass it through a daige.
You pick up a couple minutes here and there with those.
You also need to be a master at scheduling and always have Plan B, C and D.
My boy dont let nobody fool ya, on this part.
Your billing has to be secure and seamless. QuickBooks Pro is your new best friend
My close friend is of the first 12 people world wide to earn a PHD in Accounting. He is the Professor now. Long time ago he stated the QB is the greatest threat to the accounting industry. Yeah I love it Invoice, process payment, email out the receipt All right there on the home page
Get a iMac and QB Pro. Dedicate this computer to that only.
ITS YOUR MONEY! Do not cut corners. iMac and QB Pro is smooth.
I use cable modems and Linksys Pro Safe VPN ethernet switch.
Pass word and encrypt the iMac. for the past 4 years Flawless, not even a hiccup.
About $1200 all together....... Dude! your making a .5 mil it is an straight expense
and is just really nice when you sit down to make your bank.
yeah man, you can thank me later
6pk Sol Cerveza works for me. Cheers
Finally, get a shop flunky. You aint gonna handle .5mil by yourself
even with all the big stuff out sourced.
At half mil you are making more than enough, the flunky is making it possible for you to go home at a decent hour and some weekends off. Have you ver worked 10 hours a day every day with no days off for 5 years? you aint gonna like it not nary a bit
I am in my 41st year of Graphics and my 31st year of being the Graphics guy for my customers. I love what I do, and I love my customers.
I do not do the sign shop retail thing.
To produce at this level, first and foremost, you have to know your 'sh T
You have to know your Outsourcing Companies and are intimate with their work flow and scheduling.
In your own shop your time is Money, you are not skimping on materials either.
You get a roll of carppy vinyl or you have received yet another roll of mis marked
transfer tape ,,,,,,, Are you F N Kidding me?
Lemme tell ya, The cheapest vinyls in your shop are 3m Intermediates and
1005 or 180. My lams are Luster 8509 and 8519.
You have Zero time for errors and 3m SC50 series weeds out beautifully
and the IJ35c-10 is unreal when you go to weed out.
I have bought them all, tried them all dozens of times and 3m is the most consistant
Your Transfer tape Is Transferrite 6782 Ultra This is the near equivalent to 3m scps-2.
I have zero problems with this tape and when you just spent 30 minutes on a weed out
and you have a mis marked roll of Carp Tape. and that sheet just hit the trash can.
Yeah there went your $20 savings.. Skrew that
6782 is $100 a roll and it performs well with the cv3 liners, the peliminary lay down
(ironing the sheets) is clean and just hit it with the squeeg or just pass it through a daige.
You pick up a couple minutes here and there with those.
You also need to be a master at scheduling and always have Plan B, C and D.
My boy dont let nobody fool ya, on this part.
Your billing has to be secure and seamless. QuickBooks Pro is your new best friend
My close friend is of the first 12 people world wide to earn a PHD in Accounting. He is the Professor now. Long time ago he stated the QB is the greatest threat to the accounting industry. Yeah I love it Invoice, process payment, email out the receipt All right there on the home page
Get a iMac and QB Pro. Dedicate this computer to that only.
ITS YOUR MONEY! Do not cut corners. iMac and QB Pro is smooth.
I use cable modems and Linksys Pro Safe VPN ethernet switch.
Pass word and encrypt the iMac. for the past 4 years Flawless, not even a hiccup.
About $1200 all together....... Dude! your making a .5 mil it is an straight expense
and is just really nice when you sit down to make your bank.
yeah man, you can thank me later
6pk Sol Cerveza works for me. Cheers
Finally, get a shop flunky. You aint gonna handle .5mil by yourself
even with all the big stuff out sourced.
At half mil you are making more than enough, the flunky is making it possible for you to go home at a decent hour and some weekends off. Have you ver worked 10 hours a day every day with no days off for 5 years? you aint gonna like it not nary a bit
I am in my 41st year of Graphics and my 31st year of being the Graphics guy for my customers. I love what I do, and I love my customers.
I do not do the sign shop retail thing.
Notarealsignguy
Arial - it's almost helvetica
In response to ickysoup
20%+/- is about average in just about every small business. Lower gross probably has a bit higher margins and higher gross probably dents it a bit. You also can't forget that were in a super heated economy right now. If you are ever curious, just look at businesses that are for sale. They publicly list gross and "owner benefit" which is just an inflated net
20%+/- is about average in just about every small business. Lower gross probably has a bit higher margins and higher gross probably dents it a bit. You also can't forget that were in a super heated economy right now. If you are ever curious, just look at businesses that are for sale. They publicly list gross and "owner benefit" which is just an inflated net
hybriddesign
owner Hybrid Design
We have 4-5 people and are in the 900k+ range so it's doable. We do a lot of wholesale though so our margin isn't that great and the volume is probably inflated a bit. But yeah, a lot of it depends on outsourcing. We do a lot of products overseas even though we have a all the equipment to do it in house as well