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Vinyl / Laminate combo for outdoor signs

bigwow

Premium Subscriber
We have a municipal client who is looking for a number of outdoor signs for a local park. They have a limited budget but would like the signs to last as long as possible, ideally 5-7 years - any recommendations on a reasonable price-point combination for printable substate and UV laminate suitable for the application? The graphics will be mounted to 080 aluminum, and are non-reflective.
 

bigwow

Premium Subscriber
Forgot to mention, the material will be printed with solvent inks... kind of important!
 

shoresigns

New Member
Limited budget, last as long as possible - we would usually go with high-performance calendered and matching laminate. Avery 2923 vinyl and 2080 laminate is our go-to and we usually get 3-5 years without a problem, and our climate probably somewhat similar to yours.
 

equippaint

Active Member
Can you print/cut the logo and use cut vinyl for the rest of the sign? No reason to print the entire thing if its just a logo on an otherwise basic sign. If that wont work, I have had good luck with oracal 3165 with 215 laminate.
 

Gary Wiant

New Member
Limited budget, last as long as possible - we would usually go with high-performance calendered and matching laminate. Avery 2923 vinyl and 2080 laminate is our go-to and we usually get 3-5 years without a problem, and our climate probably somewhat similar to yours.

There is no such thing as "high performance calendered" thats a marketing scheme to fool people, and the fact you are getting 3-5 years proves this is an intermediate film. Use 3m IJ180c and 8519 and don't look back. Also is this solvent ink or eco solvent ink? Eco will no last as long as Solvent.

Good luck
 

IsItFasst

New Member
My go to for cheap is a off the wall combo of 3m IJ35c and Arlon 3420 Satin laminate. This is my favorite because the 3m is 60.5" and the lam is only 60, so I don't have to deal with trimming the laminate.
Off subject, but I wish all laminate was about 1/4 to 1/2 inch narrower so we could avoid the trimming or using backer paper. Does ANYONE really need to laminate to the edge? I mean we can't print all the way to the edge so it sure would be convenient if laminate was just a little narrower than standard size rolls of vinyl.
 

ikarasu

Active Member
There is no such thing as "high performance calendered" thats a marketing scheme to fool people, and the fact you are getting 3-5 years proves this is an intermediate film. Use 3m IJ180c and 8519 and don't look back. Also is this solvent ink or eco solvent ink? Eco will no last as long as Solvent.

Good luck
I believe high performance. Calandered is polymeric. It's not a gimmick to fool people, but it's still not a great material. Alot of the cheap crap is monomeric ... Then polymeric came out. It doesn't shrink as much, and lasts a few years longer than monomeric. It's good for hobby and temp stuff... I use it on occasion, once bought a cheap roll of monomeric off eBay just for some testing purposes.. Never again. It was shrunk by close to a quarter inch before I even opened the box.

We use some 3m calandered for cheap stuff... Like ij35. Real estate signs don't last more than a few years, so they're the perfect candidate.

Anything that's not temporary , or anything we know will get beat up and need replacing before 5 years we use calandered. For everything else we use cast... We go through 20 rolls of cast to 1 roll of calandered.
 

Split76

New Member
besides the original question, I order all my laminates narrowed by 10 millimetres (a bit in inches :D )
edit: it doesn't cost me anything
 

Gary Wiant

New Member
Calling a calendered vinyl "High Performace" Lenin fact a gimmick, we've been conditioned for years that "high performace" will last 7 years but if they are only getting 3-5years ( the typical life of calendered) that is what they are - Intermediate.

If they are polymeric and truely last longer than intermediate then sign Vinyl manufacturers need to come up with a new name or classification different than intermediate & high performace.
 

ProColorGraphics

New Member
I have been LOVING the Hexis HX200WG2 and PC30G2 vinyl and laminate combo!! High performance calendared vinyl with a cast laminate. Very easy to apply and looks great!
 

shoresigns

New Member
There is no such thing as "high performance calendered" thats a marketing scheme to fool people, and the fact you are getting 3-5 years proves this is an intermediate film.
Yes, I'm aware that high performance calendered = intermediate. OP asked for an economical option that will last as long as possible. In reality, 3-5 years is the minimum that we expect from intermediate vinyl, but to cover ourselves we don't promise any more than that. We haven't actually seen any failures on our intermediate calendered signs beyond 5 years either.
 

equippaint

Active Member
I havent had any failures on older intermediate calendered vinyl either and dont understand all this fuss over it. Honestly, who is buying a print/lam sign and expecting it to last 8-10 years? Shouldn't they be buying something a little more substantial and not something spit off of a printer if that is their goal?
I can see cast for vehicles and things with complex or large contours but in my mind printed exterior signs are not "long term" no matter what material you use. No reason to make a sign where the vinyl will outlast the ink.
 

TimToad

Active Member
I'm still waiting for somebody to explain how using cast "wrap" 3M IJ180CV3 with 3M 8519 LAM on a job with a tight budget and less than five year life expectancy makes sense for the producer or the client.

We use either Orajet 3165RA and Oraguard 210 or 215, or 3M IJ35C and 8508 or 09 for our day to day work with an average budget and life expectancy in mind.
 

JaySea20

New Member
I have seen some great life out of IJ35C and the 3165RA. As well as 3640G! But, I would stay away from the 210 laminate. I have had issues with it getting UV Burn. I use 3220 now.

Good Luck!
 
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