Are wall printers the end of cut vinyl? or is it just a headwind to mind?

[citysignshop]

I saw an online demo, oh....20 years ago....of one of these rigs..... printing on the side of a VAN!!!! Yeah, I'm sure it worked for their demo, but talk about a myriad of issues to follow! Never saw that ever again.....

 

[budlinch]

We all know this- technology changes. This will too. It will be made smaller, faster and better. It always starts at some point and gets better which will take time. DTF is the same thing. It is slowly becoming better then printing and cutting on vinyl.
Just the way of the world/technology.

 

[Kev-O-Rama]

Wall printer companies would have to collaborate with framing drywall finishing companies, because you can ask any sign company who's ever put up wall wraps and they'll tell you most walls that are constructed these days are not plumb, level or remotely flat from end-to-end.

We just did an 11'h x 22' long wall wrap this week that was so undulating really badly that if we had to install any ACM panels, it would've been a nightmare. You'd never know because it was painted white and a matte finish. The baseboard was 1.5" lower on one end (thankfully, I always add a few inches of bleed just for this reason) and the ceiling was 2" higher on the other end. The last 3 feet of the wall angled out a good 1.5" from the rest of the wall plane. (see attached -- and yes, those are pipes & Boxes and random wires cropping out of the wall)

I'm not sure how the wall printers work (I assume on upper/lower rails), but I can't imagine it would be very practical unless you've checked the trueness of the wall. For my money, nothing beats wall wraps/panels or hand-painted graphics, depending on the subject matter. (note on that last comment: I did a 100-ft wide wall x 8ft tall "finish line obstacle" wall that was hand-painted to look like a giant, weathered, steel wall with rusty rivets and a "rubber stamp" set of logos for Men's Health magazine. It would've taken me 10X longer to do with a wrap, not counting design time. It was also WAY FUNNER!!

 

[victor bogdanov]

Wall printer companies would have to collaborate with framing drywall finishing companies, because you can ask any sign company who's ever put up wall wraps and they'll tell you most walls that are constructed these days are not plumb, level or remotely flat from end-to-end.

We just did an 11'h x 22' long wall wrap this week that was so undulating really badly that if we had to install any ACM panels, it would've been a nightmare. You'd never know because it was painted white and a matte finish. The baseboard was 1.5" lower on one end (thankfully, I always add a few inches of bleed just for this reason) and the ceiling was 2" higher on the other end. The last 3 feet of the wall angled out a good 1.5" from the rest of the wall plane.

I'm not sure how the wall printers work (I assume on upper/lower rails), but I can't imagine it would be very practical unless you've checked the trueness of the wall. For my money, nothing beats wall wraps/panels or hand-painted graphics, depending on the subject matter. (note on that last comment: I did a 100-ft wide wall x 8ft tall "finish line obstacle" wall that was hand-painted to look like a giant, weathered, steel wall with rusty rivets and a "rubber stamp" set of logos for Men's Health magazine. It would've taken me 10X longer to do with a wrap, not counting design time. It was also WAY FUNNER!!

They're not even capable of going floor to ceiling / edge to edge like you can with vinyl

 

[unclebun]

We all know this- technology changes. This will too. It will be made smaller, faster and better. It always starts at some point and gets better which will take time. DTF is the same thing. It is slowly becoming better then printing and cutting on vinyl.
Just the way of the world/technology.

Just like AI--enough money and time, yet we're still waiting for it to really be what they promise. Wall printers have been around for over 30 years (when I first noticed them being touted). Yet they are not mainstream yet.

DTF, on the other hand, appeared just a couple of years ago and immediately was superior and is already mainstream.

 

[victor bogdanov]

Just like AI--enough money and time, yet we're still waiting for it to really be what they promise

AI - is doing more than you think. my brother is a software engineer at a big tech company and 90% of programing now is done with AI mostly. projects that used to take 2 weeks can now be done in 2 days.

the ai that is publicly available is significantly behind the ai top companies are using. like comparing mspaint to photoshop .


A successful clothing line I print for uses AI for 100% of the design work. I'm using it daily too, now instead of paying $500 for a new wallpaper designs I can have ai create it in minutes for basically free

 

[Pauly]

AI - is doing more than you think. my brother is a software engineer at a big tech company and 90% of programing now is done with AI mostly. projects that used to take 2 weeks can now be done in 2 days.

the ai that is publicly available is significantly behind the ai top companies are using. like comparing mspaint to photoshop .


A successful clothing line I print for uses AI for 100% of the design work. I'm using it daily too, now instead of paying $500 for a new wallpaper designs I can have ai create it in minutes for basically free

Which app are you using for image gen for repeat patterns?

Oh you're 100% right with software engineers.
Mostly they use Claude Code.

 

[victor bogdanov]

Which app are you using for image gen for repeat patterns?

Oh you're 100% right with software engineers.
Mostly they use Claude Code.

I've been using topaz bloom, give in an inspiration image, some text with changes etc and it does an extremely good job. Local rendering takes a while though wall sized graphic takes 10+ minutes per variation running on a 7900XTX and 7950x both maxed 100% for 10 minutes. Cloud is faster but still a few minutes

 

[ProSignTN]

To answer your question: NO

 

[cornholio]

I stayed in a hotel in Italy some 5 years ago and they had images on the walls in the public restrooms of the restaurant and also in the hotel rooms. I asked at the reception, if they can tell me the company, that did these prints. They kindly gave me the name of a company in Bolzano and that way i found out the printer they used.
It was a company in Germany and i contacted them for a visit.
They showed me jobs, done with their printer and gave a demo of the printer at their premises.
It used some pretty old Xaar128 printheads with very big drop sizes.
This makes sense, because of the long distance, the drops have to fly.
I also found out, their software had no way of doing color management even in the most basic way.
The mechanical construction looked solid, but failed to have some features i saw as essential.
At a price tag of 45k, it was too much of a niche product for me.

The printers using DX7 heads just don't make any sense at all. Too small drops and too unreliable without a regular cleaning during printing.

Many years a ago, there was a printer using airbrush pistols. I first saw it at a sign show and later at a customers of mine.
They lost a lot of money with it...
The name of the printer was Michelangelo...

 

[unclebun]

Yes! That was the company I was talking about with the paint sprayer.

 

[Think713]

I recently had a client inform me they were using a wall printer for their next exhibition. https://thewallprinter.com/en/ I looked into this tech a few years ago and found it to be very poor quality. Since then though now there seems to be a lot of companies doing this. They can also sell their product as environmentally friendly and at a fraction of the cost. Wondering if anyone out there has any thoughts as to whether or not this tech is a serious headwind to get ahead of? I mean printing to me has always felt harder than cut lettering, installing is one shot, and to put those two things together seems ludicrous, but maybe the tech is there now? Crossing my fingers.

I dont think these are the end of anything. This is a small gimmick market for a small business's. The reality is the limitation. Wall printers cant go around corners, they cant engage edge to edge, and its now a moving liability. Every moving part is another thing that has to be replaced. You have to transport this printer around, etc etc. EVERYTHING about it is an inconvenience to the operator. Not to mention you now have to buy inks that are probably through the roof expensive.
Vinyl is better in every application. Ill die on this hill.

 

[Think713]

I stayed in a hotel in Italy some 5 years ago and they had images on the walls in the public restrooms of the restaurant and also in the hotel rooms. I asked at the reception, if they can tell me the company, that did these prints. They kindly gave me the name of a company in Bolzano and that way i found out the printer they used.
It was a company in Germany and i contacted them for a visit.
They showed me jobs, done with their printer and gave a demo of the printer at their premises.
It used some pretty old Xaar128 printheads with very big drop sizes.
This makes sense, because of the long distance, the drops have to fly.
I also found out, their software had no way of doing color management even in the most basic way.
The mechanical construction looked solid, but failed to have some features i saw as essential.
At a price tag of 45k, it was too much of a niche product for me.

The printers using DX7 heads just don't make any sense at all. Too small drops and too unreliable without a regular cleaning during printing.

Many years a ago, there was a printer using airbrush pistols. I first saw it at a sign show and later at a customers of mine.
They lost a lot of money with it...
The name of the printer was Michelangelo...

not to mention german engineering fails constantly... See VW and BMW and imagine importing one of these machines and the only techs available have to be flown in from germany... HELLL to the NO...

 

[Think713]

Many screenprinters are switching to dtf, industrial dtg is very good too. The smart screenprinters are using the digital methods.

Especially as print on demand becomes more popular

Not a good comparison

Ehh debatable... GOOD screen prints are not done with dtg printers. The best forms of screen printing are done with discharge inks, and you're not going to get that from a dtg printer. You need a press and screens.

 

[Think713]

I don't want to negative about new tech, but I keep wondering "what happens if a nozzle goes out?" It seems like it would be difficult to keep the heads in good shape.

Everything bad about this tech comes down the maintenance. Because you move the hardware to the jobsite, it becomes a liability. Its not negative to be realistic.
Cool idea, but in practice its not going to take over anything. Its not superior. In any fashion.

 

[Think713]

ever had your printer choke at the last foot of a 20 foot banner?

Exactly Imagine having your printer die mid job, or completely shit the bed, and now not only are you not gonna make any money, YOU have to pay the business to repaint their wall....

 

[jamessmith11]

To answer your question : No , because Vinyl still leads in durability, finish quality, and versatility, making it the preferred choice for most long-term and high-impact applications.

 

[netsol]

Exactly Imagine having your printer die mid job, or completely shit the bed, and now not only are you not gonna make any money, YOU have to pay the business to repaint their

my biggest concern would be head strikes
("i pulled all the push pins from the wall EXCEPT ONE. "

i always thought this would be a neat toy.
biggest problem is the new paints that nothing sticks to.
if you are painting the wall, you would be dealing 20 days out, at best, before you could run the machine.

then comes the problem with specifying what kind of paint & having the painters sub cheap chinese garbage paint & pocket the difference.

 

[Think713]

my biggest concern would be head strikes
("i pulled all the push pins from the wall EXCEPT ONE. "

i always thought this would be a neat toy.
biggest problem is the new paints that nothing sticks to.
if you are painting the wall, you would be dealing 20 days out, at best, before you could run the machine.

then comes the problem with specifying what kind of paint & having the painters sub cheap chinese garbage paint & pocket the difference.

Totally. Thats a whole different can of worms in itself. Just another reason that its not as useful of tech as the companies that are advertising are trying to tout. I think its going to remain in gimmick land.

 

[netsol]

Totally. Thats a whole different can of worms in itself. Just another reason that its not as useful of tech as the companies that are advertising are trying to tout. I think its going to remain in gimmick land.

but, a fun toy to play with...