Double sided stickers for windows

[bigben]

So I have an HP 700w and use white 98% for spot white or reverse prints. I have to make double sided stickers and I've used the 3 layers with 160% white. The white is not opaque enough so I will try the 5 layers. My concern is it take alot of ink and alot of time but I calculate the cost of using a material like drytac blouckout and a clear vinyl stick together and my end cost/profit is pretty similar to 3 layers. .

My question is, what most shops use for material, technique or printer to ''economically'' print double sided stickers that the other layer won't show on the other side? I'm just curious because from my tests, the white ink from latex is more opaque than UV.

 

[signheremd]

We use a Mimaki UCJV330 and print five layers on clear vinyl: color with reverse reading text, white, black, white, color with right reading text.

 

[bigben]

We use a Mimaki UCJV330 and print five layers on clear vinyl: color with reverse reading text, white, black, white, color with right reading text.

If you print with 3 layers with the most white in pourcentage, is it opaque enough or you can see the other side through it and this is why you print 5 layers? Also, can you give me an idea of how much time it take you to print a 24inX48in panel in 5 layers?

 

[P Wagner]

No white ink is completely opaque, that is the reason for 5-layer prints (CWKWC) which are intended for double-sided opaque graphics on windows with no visible bleed-thru, even when when backlit.

 

[bigben]

No white ink is completely opaque, that is the reason for 5-layer prints (CWKWC) which are intended for double-sided opaque graphics on windows with no visible bleed-thru, even when when backlit.

Does all kind of printers cannot have an opaque white so all shops that make double sided decals all prints in 5 layers? It will at least give me a good idea of the process used in general.

 

[Boudica]

We have double sided window decal capabilities. We do it as 5-layer prints but we have an Agfa Annapurna UV flat bed printer to do it. The white on the Annapurna is more opaque than the white on echo solvent printers, but we still print 5 layers with a black layer in the middle so the other side doesn't bleed through. CWBWC

 

[bigben]

We have double sided window decal capabilities. We do it as 5-layer prints but we have an Agfa Annapurna UV flat bed printer to do it. The white on the Annapurna is more opaque than the white on echo solvent printers, but we still print 5 layers with a black layer in the middle so the other side doesn't bleed through. CWBWC

Can you give me an idea of the time it take to print a certain job in 5 layers? I'm curious to know your sqft/h in 5 layers.

 

[Boudica]

Can you give me an idea of the time it take to print a certain job in 5 layers? I'm curious to know your sqft/h in 5 layers.

The time it would take to print a "certain job" would be about 5 -60 minutes. Just printing time, not counting setting everything up.

Idk, I don't really keep track of that. Is it one print, or a large run of said print?

 

[bigben]

The time it would take to print a "certain job" would be about 5 -60 minutes. Just printing time, not counting setting everything up.

Idk, I don't really keep track of that. Is it one print, or a large run of said print?

I just want to have an idea of what is your average square foot per hour to print 5 layers.

 

[Boudica]

I just want to have an idea of what is your average square foot per hour to print 5 layers.

gotcha, I don't do the business voodoo stuff, I just make things happen.
sorry I can't help you there. We have different equipment anyway... so It may not be that comparable in a helpful way to you.

 

[P Wagner]

5-layer printing on the Latex 700W is the slowest print mode by a significant margin. It is roughly 15-20 square feet per hour in that print mode (assuming that the full width of the printer is being used). The newer 730/ 830W units are 30-percent faster in UF and Sandwich modes. Printing unattended overnight is the way to go when printing 5-layer.

 

[signheremd]

If you print with 3 layers with the most white in pourcentage, is it opaque enough or you can see the other side through it and this is why you print 5 layers? Also, can you give me an idea of how much time it take you to print a 24inX48in panel in 5 layers?

No white is opaque enough for two sided printing, which is why white vinyl has a gray adhesive or even a black adhesive to block out whatever it is applied over. For door decals, you often have to consider sunlight shining through from outside when people are going outside from inside and need the decal information readable. it might take me 15-20 minutes to print a 2x4 5-layer decal depending on print resolution selected. Ink costs are low relative to many other ink types - as long as you run some volume through the machine so as to use up the inks before the expiration dates. You can focus on ink cost per square foot, but a better estimate of profitability is total expenses versus total income each year - that will give you an opportunity to see the hidden cost of being in business and allow you to raise or lower your estimates to maintain profitability and volume of jobs. An old quick estimate of costs was: 25% materials, 25% labor, 25% overhead, 25% profit. Hope that helps

 

[MarkSnelling]

So I have an HP 700w and use white 98% for spot white or reverse prints. I have to make double sided stickers and I've used the 3 layers with 160% white. The white is not opaque enough so I will try the 5 layers. My concern is it take alot of ink and alot of time but I calculate the cost of using a material like drytac blouckout and a clear vinyl stick together and my end cost/profit is pretty similar to 3 layers. .

My question is, what most shops use for material, technique or printer to ''economically'' print double sided stickers that the other layer won't show on the other side? I'm just curious because from my tests, the white ink from latex is more opaque than UV.

Ben - There is a new film from Drytac called Print Duo. It is a 10mil white/white that is 100% opaque. You can print double sided on it and then run it through a laminator with a clear adhesive. Very simple. I've got stock in Cleveland. The 60"x100' rolls of Print Duo are only $166.18 and they are rolling out 54"x150' rolls soon and those are only $265.55 when they get to my warehouse. If you are installing the graphics, then Retac Duo is a great perm/removable clear adhesive. 54"x150' rolls are only $345.28. I currently have 9 rolls of the adhesive and 6 rolls of the print media in Cleveland, but you can clearly get this stuff from the likes of Treck Hall or ND up in Toronto.

 

[RabidOne]

Ben - There is a new film from Drytac called Print Duo. It is a 10mil white/white that is 100% opaque. You can print double sided on it and then run it through a laminator with a clear adhesive. Very simple. I've got stock in Cleveland. The 60"x100' rolls of Print Duo are only $166.18 and they are rolling out 54"x150' rolls soon and those are only $265.55 when they get to my warehouse. If you are installing the graphics, then Retac Duo is a great perm/removable clear adhesive. 54"x150' rolls are only $345.28. I currently have 9 rolls of the adhesive and 6 rolls of the print media in Cleveland, but you can clearly get this stuff from the likes of Treck Hall or ND up in Toronto.

Hey Mark,

Have you had any feedback from users on this? Sounds like something we could use so then we just need to replace the 800 with an 830 so we don't have to do all the monkeying around to print double sided.

 

[MarkSnelling]

Hey Mark,

Have you had any feedback from users on this? Sounds like something we could use so then we just need to replace the 800 with an 830 so we don't have to do all the monkeying around to print double sided.

I have one major retailer who is burning through this solution. They print double sided on the Colorado and then run it through the laminator. store employees put the graphics up which are around 30x40".