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Experience with Epson f6370

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bgphoto

New Member
I am trying to find out what kind of experience others have had with the Epson f6370.

Our company prints on Chromaluxe Panels and have had one of these machines since September '21. First several months went really well. We were very impressed with the quality of the print jobs completed.

In december we had a brown color shift occur in b/w midtones. That was resolved by Epson replacing the entire inkset along with the ink cartidges.

In February we had a green color shift occur in b/w midtones. That was resolved by doing some heavy cleanings and light cleanings. We also subsequently found out that some color images were no longer the same as printed in december following the replacement of the inks.

We finally had to completely re-linearize and profile the printer.

At this time we are day-to-day, but no longer have confidence in this machine over the long hall.

We are working with Epson for a resolution but am looking for any feedback from others on this machine.

Thanks!

Ben
Ks
 
C

ColorCrest

All around shop helper.
bgphoto said:
In december we had a brown color shift occur in b/w midtones. That was resolved by Epson replacing the entire inkset along with the ink cartidges.

In February we had a green color shift occur in b/w midtones. That was resolved by doing some heavy cleanings and light cleanings. We also subsequently found out that some color images were no longer the same as printed in december following the replacement of the inks.
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You are simply not calibrating often enough or there is some trouble with workflow. Describe your calibration routine and workflow if you don't mind.
 
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bgphoto

New Member
How often would you suggest calibrating? I have used an Epson 9800 for 5 years with J-Teck ink and calibrated twice with no color shifts!

(Epson and I spoke for an hour concerning my workflow/calibration routine and found no issues)
 
C

ColorCrest

All around shop helper.
bgphoto said:
No clue what your talking about!
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"Running a Shirley" is exactly tantamount to strumming a guitar to learn if it's in tune or not before playing a song.

"Shirley" was / is the nickname for the girl who modeled for the commercial photographer in a setting with bright primary colors and known grey values. A film exposure was made and then printed in order to learn the color balance of the process so any adjustments could be made in necessary. Photo labs test their processes routinely throughout the work day, still. Your print process is rather similar because it's using heat and a color transfer process.

More later.
 
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ColorCrest

All around shop helper.
With simple control files such as Shirleys (same as quality evaluation files) which should be used as a manner of routine according to volume, shops can easily catch issues before wasting time and materials on unacceptable production work. With inkjet printers, the files will often show color problems before actually nozzle checks will because they stress the system to a much greater degree.
 
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bgphoto

New Member
We already do a quality test on a regular basis. This is how we caught the second color shift issue. Sadly, running the heavy cleanings helped with the midtone grey scale issues but did not help with the color problem. We then relinearized the printer, which should have resolved the issue but did not. After reprofiling we are close with our new profile on color but not so on the b/w. So, we now run two different configurations, one for b/w and one for color. This machine should not have these issues in less than 6 months use.

Trust me, we have been over the issue with Epson as well as the technician endless times and cannot find flaw in what we do.

The purpose of this post was to find out if others are seeing this color shift issue with this line of printers, not to see if I have problems/defects in my process.

I appreciate you attempt at helping though.
 
C

ColorCrest

All around shop helper.
bgphoto said:
The purpose of this post was to find out if others are seeing this color shift issue with this line of printers,
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Contact Scott Martin at Onsite from the link...
https://www.on-sight.com/contact/

Scott will need to visit your shop and work with you and will explain why the visit is necessary. He has more experience with your machines and processes that anyone in the U.S.

(Know that I am not affiliated in any way with the resource above.)
 
S

scrubz

New Member
I have one, but just a few weeks now, so far so good....knock wood. This probably has nothing to do with your issue, but the HDK cartridge has a pump that they say to pump 15 times every week, im guessing to suspend the solids after settling. Have you been pumping your printer ? ;)
 
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bgphoto

New Member
We were pumping 1-3 times per week. Now we pump everyday we are in the shop.

Unisub has a document out of their European office that states all inks need to be agitated on this machine. It also states that they should be agitated every day.
 
edcooleyar

edcooleyar

Premium Subscriber
Ben, I know exactly what you mean. We fought with color shifts on ChromaLuxe with the Epson F7200, 6200 and 6370 printers since we started doing metal. It was constant problems with no help from UW or Epson. The biggest problems were the prints would cure way too yellow.

We switched rips a few times and ended up with ergosoft. To get rid of color cast we were editing dot gains after the profile was created which I hated. Customers were pleased but I knew our color management was flawed. We finally started doing black and white ramps once a week and putting in correction - a terrible idea.

We also had the greens in our black and white prints. This is a common issue with chromaluxe and I have seen it in prints from many labs, some that are known for their color accuracy. We especially had problems in areas of high detail that would have this weird bright green color.

We had some ink problems once but I think that was just a bad batch or maybe distributor put it in a hot place or something. We replaced all four colors to be safe and moved on.

When we purchased our Arizona and Colorado printers everything was printing ok but there were always slight differences in color from each machine. Not noticable unless you laid them side by side.

I’ve built my own profiles from the lightjet days. It was a hard pill to swallow but I decided enough and hired Mike Adams. I had seen chromaluxe prints from competitors that I knew he profiled and was impressed enough to take the plunge.

He came in a month ago and did 12 or 14 profiles over a span of three days. All our products now match in color and he got substantial quality improvements out of every printer. He obviously understands both color and cmyk print processing especially with light inksets. The Chromaluxe has never looked better and we have not seen the green cast in neutrals since - I’m keeping my fingers crossed.

I have had several customers notice the improvements which surprised me. You know how that is, you see prints every day and can see things but it’s nice when clients appreciate the improvements.

Ed

083F4094-D7B3-488A-A037-62B432C85744.jpeg
 
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bgphoto

New Member
edcooleyar said:
Ben, I know exactly what you mean. We fought with color shifts on ChromaLuxe with the Epson F7200, 6200 and 6370 printers since we started doing metal. It was constant problems with no help from UW or Epson. The biggest problems were the prints would cure way too yellow.

We switched rips a few times and ended up with ergosoft. To get rid of color cast we were editing dot gains after the profile was created which I hated. Customers were pleased but I knew our color management was flawed. We finally started doing black and white ramps once a week and putting in correction - a terrible idea.

We also had the greens in our black and white prints. This is a common issue with chromaluxe and I have seen it in prints from many labs, some that are known for their color accuracy. We especially had problems in areas of high detail that would have this weird bright green color.

We had some ink problems once but I think that was just a bad batch or maybe distributor put it in a hot place or something. We replaced all four colors to be safe and moved on.

When we purchased our Arizona and Colorado printers everything was printing ok but there were always slight differences in color from each machine. Not noticable unless you laid them side by side.

I’ve built my own profiles from the lightjet days. It was a hard pill to swallow but I decided enough and hired Mike Adams. I had seen chromaluxe prints from competitors that I knew he profiled and was impressed enough to take the plunge.

He came in a month ago and did 12 or 14 profiles over a span of three days. All our products now match in color and he got substantial quality improvements out of every printer. He obviously understands both color and cmyk print processing especially with light inksets. The Chromaluxe has never looked better and we have not seen the green cast in neutrals since - I’m keeping my fingers crossed.

I have had several customers notice the improvements which surprised me. You know how that is, you see prints every day and can see things but it’s nice when clients appreciate the improvements.

Ed

View attachment 158175
Click to expand...
 
B

bgphoto

New Member
Do you still use the Epson f6370 printer? If you still use the 6370, did swapping the ink solve the problem longterm?
 
edcooleyar

edcooleyar

Premium Subscriber
Yes we still use the 6370 and the 7200. we mothballed the 6200. The 6370 is our preferred printer. The 7200 is really a fabric printer which we re-engineered for chromaluxe.
 
4

4DPB

New Member
I have been using a 6370 for 2 years now & so far no issues. I consider myself lucky but we aren't heavy users. We did have some yellow issues originally but somehow it resolved on its own. I did play with the curve a little.
For Black & White Prints we always had issues.
We established a workflow converting the image to Grayscale and then back to RGB.

But there was no magic bullet.

How are you doing linearization on the 6370 (are you using a separate RIP?)

From what I understand the EPSON standard profiles are very good - better than what was used prior.
 
edcooleyar

edcooleyar

Premium Subscriber
We use ergosoft for rip and linearization then xrite for profiles. Just be sure to let the profile charts settle before scanning them - like 12-24 hours to be safe.
 
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