It's that time again in our shop for a new printer and after being a Roland shop for the last 15 years it's time for a change. Our latest printer was an XR-640 which has been ok except for it's inability to hit nice deep reds (we kept our old XC-540 for that). I've heard that either of these Epson models will be a substantial upgrade as far as color production goes but I'm wondering if the S80800 would be a large step up for matching specific motorsports colors (KTM Orange, Kawasaki Green, Honda Red, etc). Also how have current Epson owners found these machines for greys as compared to a Roland set up with light black ink? Thank you in advance for any and all replies and thoughts.
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Discussion S60600 vs S80800 for Dirt Bike/ Sled Graphics as well as all around use?
- Thread starter Gforce1
- Start date
Our biggest issue with the rolands previous to the model with light black ink was the greys always had a tinge of another color. Usually green and it was really nice to finally move away from that.
SignMeUpGraphics
Super Active Member
We print MX decals on our S80600 regularly. You'll have zero issue with hitting KTM and Honda colours due to dedicated Orange/Red inks. Kawasaki you can get close-ish, but the Epson doesn't have a dedicated green ink channel so you won't get it spot on. It's still miles better than our old VS-540 was able to produce.
We make our own profiles, and have zero colour cast in blacks/greys. Everything prints extremely accurately all the time. It's a great printer for an extremely wide variety of print uses.
We make our own profiles, and have zero colour cast in blacks/greys. Everything prints extremely accurately all the time. It's a great printer for an extremely wide variety of print uses.
Thank you very much for the info. That's great to hear. The Kawi's I've been able to get really close with the Roland so I'm sure I'll have no issue there on the Epson but I've always hated doing Honda's as I could never match it close enough for my own satisfaction. Customers have been happy but I wasn't.
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SignMeUpGraphics
Super Active Member
I have an order waiting to be confirmed to print K green in the next week or so. I'll take a photo if I remember so you can see what we're outputting.
Just realised you also mentioned the 60600 in your title. That model is dual CMYK so won't have the dedicated Orange/Red inks so won't give the same colour output. It's a fantastic printer still, extremely quick, but gamut won't be the same as the 80600.
Just realised you also mentioned the 60600 in your title. That model is dual CMYK so won't have the dedicated Orange/Red inks so won't give the same colour output. It's a fantastic printer still, extremely quick, but gamut won't be the same as the 80600.
jfiscus
Rap Master
It all depends on your target market. If you're doing a bunch of non-commercial one-off stuff like motorbikes, I'd say 80600 as it does hit a bit wider spectrum of color. It is a bit slower, and the colors will fade over time but that isn't as important for non-commercial work. If you're doing commercial/fleet wraps I'd recommend a 60600 as it is faster, less ink carts to stock, and the inks don't fade. Either one will get you GREAT grays and bright colors.
aren't they the same inks? Or are you saying the LC,LM,LK,O,&R will fade, but the CMYK inks won't?
balstestrat
Problem Solver
CMYK will fade too as time goes on but usually the special colors like Red or Orange fade faster.
Anyway that's what they say. I haven't tried.
jfiscus
Rap Master
YES. The additional inks fade a whole lot faster. Different pigments used and are NOT warranted against fading by anyone.
SignMeUpGraphics
Super Active Member
This keeps getting repeated, however I've had 021C Orange printed outdoors for years and it still looks fine and isn't fading any faster than any of the surrounding colours.
We still mention the volatility to our clients and give them the option of Orange inks or a CMYK mix.
P Wagner
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The 3M MCS (Matched Component System) expressly excludes GS3 Red, Orange, White, and Metallic inks from any warranty (see attached).
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jfiscus
Rap Master
This fade was after a year using an Epson 70670 with all inks in the profile. We started noticing fading and Epson just said "sorry our inks are not warranted for any certain period" and left us high and dry.
I believe the newer 80600 inks are "better" but I sure as heck am not going to trust them any time soon.
We adhere to (and are certified through) the 3M MCS system for our printers/inks/vinyl now.
I believe the newer 80600 inks are "better" but I sure as heck am not going to trust them any time soon.
We adhere to (and are certified through) the 3M MCS system for our printers/inks/vinyl now.
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SignMeUpGraphics
Super Active Member
Yeah, apparently the yellows on previous generation were terrible, leading reds to turn magenta quickly. Haven't noticed that on the S80 yet thankfully.
F1225hgB42w
Guest
What settings do you use to generate your black ink curves to get perfect neutral black and white prints?
Do you change the idf for your ICC profiles?
Thanks!
Zendavor Signs
Mmmmm....signs
Achieving perfectly neutral grays will always be a challenge with CMYK, even with very good profiles. Moving away from light black inks will be a downgrade if you’re picky.
I hear you on the red issue with Roland. Have had a SP-300V for over 12 years (still going) that prints beautiful reds. Added a VS-300i to my office 2 years ago and can not get a good red (always print with a hint of orange). I have custom profiled this machine over 5 times using all kinds of different setting and nothing changes...reds just print with an orange hue to them. It's like the Max2 inks just won't produce a bright but deep red. And after all the horror stories I've read about new ones I'm looking at a different brand for the next one.
SignMeUpGraphics
Super Active Member
We use the Epson workflow in Onyx and generate/read our targets in i1Profiler. Most of the hard work is automated and we don't have to tweak anything manually.
SignMeUpGraphics
Super Active Member
I have an MX job tomorrow... I'll post some pics of our reds and greens. No 021C Orange this time around though.
Hi, there are profiles available from 3M for Onyx for the 80600 that deliver MCS warranty. They do not use red or orange.