SAI Flexi 10 Major Disappointment!

[TheGrandWazoo]

Last week we had an error message with our Flexi 10 software and it wouldn't boot up. We contacted Fellers support that told us they offered no support, but suggested that we buy the newer version or to try contacting SAI Flexi about the issue! After days of waiting, we finally heard back from SAI FLexi via email. Keep in mind, production has stopped, employees are standing around! They didn't offer any type of support, and I mean none, only to buy the newer version! Does anyone else see were this is going? This is the very type of corporate abuse that our country needs to stop and put end to! In a panic, we searched for other Rip Software used by professionals and downloaded Onyx's Thrive 30 trial to keep production going. It is absolutely awesome and the learning curve was minimal, prints and colors look great! After the horrible and incredibly disappointing service and complete neglect of support coupled with the totalitarian-forcing to buy, buy, buy from both companies, I will no longer "support" them and their products. I guess its a two way street and a hard lesson learned. Don't be surprised to see future expressions of experience. Grimco sells Onyx and they have always had amazing support, service and products. They told me that they have a payment plan that I can apply for to make it manageble to make the purchase... goodbye fellers and SAI Flexi!

 

[Jburns]

sounds like a plan!

 

[TomK]

You did receive notices that they were planning this for a very very very long time, correct?

 

[Reveal1]

Not unusual for a reseller to defer support to the software company, so not sure why you would blame Fellers for not supporting outdated software or even current versions. Could be wrong but I believe Flexi 10 is past end of life with 19 being the current version. We have version 12 and Flexi still supports that. Regardless, I'm going to upgrade to subscription version and as much as people seem to hate subscription, you always have the latest version and support. SAI is relatively small and I for one want them to be around to support and sell industry specific software, so subscription is a way for these companies to survive and have revenue to continually improve their product. Not sure what you mean by 'corporate abuse' but you can and are voting with your dollars, so I'm not signing on to your 'our country needs to stop' revolution whatever that means.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

This is actually pro forma and I would be very surprised that you won't get this issue again the next time your running legacy software versions for something else.

Not supporting versions that are beyond x-2 or x-3 (depending on the software, x-1 in terms of Adobe now) has been around for a very long time. Personally, I've never known that to be not the case and I've been dealing with computers since the DOS 3.2 days.

As far as subscriptions go, the biggest pro is also it's biggest con. I do believe that the assessment is correct that they probably need to go to that model to survive, but from my perspective, it's due to their software being fairly mature and not able to sustain significant improvements to continually entice people to purchase their products following the old licensing schema. Of course, there is the control factor as well. But I digress.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Not offering support is a ploy to force folks to continue to purchase more products. They only need to produce one version that they continue to sell and support. When you spend thousands of dollars on a car do they tell you they cant work on it because they dont support your car anymore? What crock of you know what. Aside from website developers, this is the only other industry to deploy these types of forced sales tactics... oh wait, we can't forget the IRS. They should at the very least help me figure out why its not working, and I mean at the very least. All they did was push their new version.... never made an attempt to help figure out what the issue was. This software should last the life of my computer and printer, hands down. I'm sorry you don't understand my other comments... not everyone will.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Not one...

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I dint mention it in my original post but we have a dongle key with our flexi, not a cloud service. I have other programs for different applications with one and we have been using them since the 90's.
Not supporting future updates and drivers is one thing, not supporting a product all together is something completely different.

 

[eahicks]

Not offering support is a ploy to force folks to continue to purchase more products. They only need to produce one version that they continue to sell and support. When you spend thousands of dollars on a car do they tell you they cant work on it because they dont support your car anymore? What crock of you know what. Aside from website developers, this is the only other industry to deploy these types of forced sales tactics... oh wait, we can't forget the IRS. They should at the very least help me figure out why its not working, and I mean at the very least. All they did was push their new version.... never made an attempt to help figure out what the issue was. This software should last the life of my computer and printer, hands down. I'm sorry you don't understand my other comments... not everyone will.

You must not have any Apple products.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

Not offering support is a ploy to force folks to continue to purchase more products. They only need to produce one version that they continue to sell and support. When you spend thousands of dollars on a car do they tell you they cant work on it because they dont support your car anymore?

Actually, there was a time when an owner couldn't work on their car for fear of voiding their warranty and that "right to repair" is under attack right now. This attack is for all devices, not just vehicles, computers, phones, tractors etc. So yes, they would certainly do that if this goes through, and they are coming from an angle of intellectual property rights and if a consumer can repair their own stuff, they would be privy to that information. Agree with that or not, that is one argument that is making the rounds.

Not supporting future updates and drivers is one thing, not supporting a product all together is something completely different.

Not quite true. They are supporting the product, just not certain versions of said product. Do you expect MS to support Vista now? Or earlier? MS still supports Windows, just not versions of a certain age. And if a specific version of a platform is no longer supported, why would you expect a version of software designed for that very specific platform version? That's a recipe for disaster right there. It's not just one thing going on here, there are a lot of strings that are attached and each one affects the situation.

There are a lot of things that make supporting older versions of software harder. Hardware that it works on being one. OSs that it works on (while there is legacy bloat in Windows, there are some things that are remove that make older programs harder to use). Then, since you said that it was dongled software, the dongle itself has to have support for the newer OSs via it's firmware etc. And at least in my experience the dongle key is usually done through a 3rd party and they are the ones that keep up with the firmware of their devices etc not the software OEM.

There is absolutely nothing new going on here. I am not saying that I like it by a long shot, but there is nothing new here. How each individual company handles the situation may be different, but the abilities that a software vendor has, hasn't changed much over the years. If you were to look at the EULA of software vendors for their product, they all pretty much have the same language and how things can change without notice. Flexi's EULA, last a checked, is also online and not a long read at all. Some EULAs not worth readying as the cost of the software doesn't warrant it, but Flexi's would.

 

[Reveal1]

Not offering support is a ploy to force folks to continue to purchase more products. They only need to produce one version that they continue to sell and support. When you spend thousands of dollars on a car do they tell you they cant work on it because they dont support your car anymore? What crock of you know what. Aside from website developers, this is the only other industry to deploy these types of forced sales tactics... oh wait, we can't forget the IRS. They should at the very least help me figure out why its not working, and I mean at the very least. All they did was push their new version.... never made an attempt to help figure out what the issue was. This software should last the life of my computer and printer, hands down. I'm sorry you don't understand my other comments... not everyone will.

Printer manufacturers, consumer electronics; now that I think of it, almost anything remotely connected with technology has a defined support life. BTW, car dealers won't work on your car for free, and try calling General Motors for tech support for your 2000 Pontiac. I get it, you're venting because you staked your business success on outdated software and now you are paying the price and looking for someone else to blame. Sorry even with my slow intellect, I'm usually pretty good figuring out reasoned and logical comments, but I guess I'm distracted trying to figure out what the IRS has to do with this.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Actually, there was a time when an owner couldn't work on their car for fear of voiding their warranty and that "right to repair" is under attack right now. This attack is for all devices, not just vehicles, computers, phones, tractors etc. So yes, they would certainly do that if this goes through, and they are coming from an angle of intellectual property rights and if a consumer can repair their own stuff, they would be privy to that information. Agree with that or not, that is one argument that is making the rounds.



Not quite true. They are supporting the product, just not certain versions of said product. Do you expect MS to support Vista now? Or earlier? MS still supports Windows, just not versions of a certain age. And if a specific version of a platform is no longer supported, why would you expect a version of software designed for that very specific platform version? That's a recipe for disaster right there. It's not just one thing going on here, there are a lot of strings that are attached and each one affects the situation.

There are a lot of things that make supporting older versions of software harder. Hardware that it works on being one. OSs that it works on (while there is legacy bloat in Windows, there are some things that are remove that make older programs harder to use). Then, since you said that it was dongled software, the dongle itself has to have support for the newer OSs via it's firmware etc. And at least in my experience the dongle key is usually done through a 3rd party and they are the ones that keep up with the firmware of their devices etc not the software OEM.

There is absolutely nothing new going on here. I am not saying that I like it by a long shot, but there is nothing new here. How each individual company handles the situation may be different, but the abilities that a software vendor has, hasn't changed much over the years. If you were to look at the EULA of software vendors for their product, they all pretty much have the same language and how things can change without notice. Flexi's EULA, last a checked, is also online and not a long read at all. Some EULAs not worth readying as the cost of the software doesn't warrant it, but Flexi's would.

Once again, I do not expect driver and update support, but I do expect that someone would help me figure out why is stopped working. Your long winded comment offers nothing in the way of an acceptable excuse for customer service. Are you a sales rep, because you sound like one?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

You must not have any Apple products.

PC my friend, Apple products are for people that don't know how to use a computer to its potential.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Actually, there was a time when an owner couldn't work on their car for fear of voiding their warranty and that "right to repair" is under attack right now. This attack is for all devices, not just vehicles, computers, phones, tractors etc. So yes, they would certainly do that if this goes through, and they are coming from an angle of intellectual property rights and if a consumer can repair their own stuff, they would be privy to that information. Agree with that or not, that is one argument that is making the rounds.



Not quite true. They are supporting the product, just not certain versions of said product. Do you expect MS to support Vista now? Or earlier? MS still supports Windows, just not versions of a certain age. And if a specific version of a platform is no longer supported, why would you expect a version of software designed for that very specific platform version? That's a recipe for disaster right there. It's not just one thing going on here, there are a lot of strings that are attached and each one affects the situation.

There are a lot of things that make supporting older versions of software harder. Hardware that it works on being one. OSs that it works on (while there is legacy bloat in Windows, there are some things that are remove that make older programs harder to use). Then, since you said that it was dongled software, the dongle itself has to have support for the newer OSs via it's firmware etc. And at least in my experience the dongle key is usually done through a 3rd party and they are the ones that keep up with the firmware of their devices etc not the software OEM.

There is absolutely nothing new going on here. I am not saying that I like it by a long shot, but there is nothing new here. How each individual company handles the situation may be different, but the abilities that a software vendor has, hasn't changed much over the years. If you were to look at the EULA of software vendors for their product, they all pretty much have the same language and how things can change without notice. Flexi's EULA, last a checked, is also online and not a long read at all. Some EULAs not worth readying as the cost of the software doesn't warrant it, but Flexi's would.

You truly represent the opposition.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Printer manufacturers, consumer electronics; now that I think of it, almost anything remotely connected with technology has a defined support life. BTW, car dealers won't work on your car for free, and try calling General Motors for tech support for your 2000 Pontiac. I get it, you're venting because you staked your business success on outdated software and now you are paying the price and looking for someone else to blame. Sorry even with my slow intellect, I'm usually pretty good figuring out reasoned and logical comments, but I guess I'm distracted trying to figure out what the IRS has to do with this.

You're not very bright...

 

[WildWestDesigns]

Once again, I do not expect driver and update support, but I do expect that someone would help me figure out why is stopped working.

Yea, you did when you said this:

They only need to produce one version that they continue to sell and support.

The only way to sell and support 1 version is to do exactly that.

Your long winded comment offers nothing in the way of an acceptable excuse for customer service. Are you a sales rep, because you sound like one?

I doubt anything would be deemed acceptable in your mind right now, but it is very much a reason/excuse/whatever you want to call it for why they do what they do.

PC my friend, Apple products are for people that don't know how to use a computer to its potential.

Ironically, Apple products (as far as iMacs, Mac Pros, MacBooks etc) are PCs as well. Might be showing my age here, but PCs are Personal Computers, meaning that they don't have to be hook up to a mainframe/server to complete tasks. Tasks can be completed on the machine alone. I blame Apple's ad campaign in the late 90s, early aughts for this muddying of the what it is with a PC.

You truly represent the opposition.

I've just been around the block a time or two with software that costs even more then Flexi. The indignant response serves no real purpose, except maybe help relieve some of the anger, frustration, but it doesn't change the situation.

What happened in this situation can (and more likely will) happen with any vendor out there given the same conditions. You may not like that fact, but to totally disregard just because you don't like it, isn't going to help you the next time it comes around. The whole point is about protecting oneself, especially if you are beholding to someone else for the well being of your business.

Now, you can either continue to be belligerent and learn nothing from the experience or learn something from this and protect yourself, so the sting isn't felt the next time or by all means, continue with the ad honimem and relieve some frustration.

 

[TomK]

So, let me summarize this thread. You have a very ancient version of Flexi. Flexi communicated for a very long time their support policy about supporting older versions and EOL'ing older versions. You ignored these notices. You have a problem with said ancient version and you are pissed because they told you to upgrade. And instead of spending $50 a month to upgrade to something recent, you are going to drop several thousand dollars on new software that could potentially change your workflow, all the while knowing Onyx will do the same thing to you in 10 years when they EOL the version you bought now. Rinse, repeat, complain.

Makes sense, not really.

 

[TomK]

You're not very bright...

Just some life advice, coming to a place where people might have offered you assistance, and trying to degrade them, usually doesn't end up very well.

The better approach would have been "Hey, SAI won't support my version of Flexi 10 and I'm having this issue....anyone ever see this or have any ideas what the problem might be?"

 

[chrisphilipps]

I know it sucks when this happens but SAi is not alone in that policy. Onyx will only support the current version and one or two previous versions and they also require you to have a valid support contract, the older the version the higher the support contract costs. Wasatch has a little grace period when you first purchase the software but then you need a support contract for support on even the current version.

SAi's policy is the current version and one version previous. Currently that means version 19 and 12. Version 10.x is 4 versions back and the last build of it was released in 8+ years ago. I know SAi sent out a notice about 10.x being end of support and end of upgrade eligible back in 2018 as well. It also doesn't help that 10.x is not Windows 10 certified.

Unfortunately software ages and needs to be upgraded, it is a cost of doing business.

 

[Texas_Signmaker]

So, let me summarize this thread. You have a very ancient version of Flexi. Flexi communicated for a very long time their support policy about supporting older versions and EOL'ing older versions. You ignored these notices. You have a problem with said ancient version and you are pissed because they told you to upgrade. And instead of spending $50 a month to upgrade to something recent, you are going to drop several thousand dollars on new software that could potentially change your workflow, all the while knowing Onyx will do the same thing to you in 10 years when they EOL the version you bought now. Rinse, repeat, complain.

Makes sense, not really.

You gotta understand, some people are just idiots.