Split back liner?

[PrintingGirl1013]

At the risk of sounding like a complete fool, I've got a question about stickers. We are a commercial print shop and have done signs and posters, vinyl to mount to foamboards, etc. on our HP Latex for many years. We do mostly business to business work but since we are in a college town we also get quite a bit of "retail" work. We are getting a Mimaki UV printer/plotter installed this week and I want to gather some ideas for all the sellable products we will be capable of doing. This brought me to a question. We've been doing quite a few "stickers" on our digital press on die cut sheets of label stock (paper) like squares, rectangles and circles, and I'm hoping we can start to move some of this work onto our Mimaki with the ability to do custom cut stickers, clear stickers, etc.

My question is, if we did custom cut stickers and they were all individual, is there a way to have a split in the liner so that people can remove them easily? Or would you have to do a kiss cut sticker in order to remove it easily from the backer? Right now customers are getting stickers that we cut to 2" x 4" or whatever but it has a split back liner since our full sheet label stocks comes that way and I want to know if we can do something similar on our new wide format machine.

 

[Boudica]

At the risk of sounding like a complete fool, I've got a question about stickers. We are a commercial print shop and have done signs and posters, vinyl to mount to foamboards, etc. on our HP Latex for many years. We do mostly business to business work but since we are in a college town we also get quite a bit of "retail" work. We are getting a Mimaki UV printer/plotter installed this week and I want to gather some ideas for all the sellable products we will be capable of doing. This brought me to a question. We've been doing quite a few "stickers" on our digital press on die cut sheets of label stock (paper) like squares, rectangles and circles, and I'm hoping we can start to move some of this work onto our Mimaki with the ability to do custom cut stickers, clear stickers, etc.

My question is, if we did custom cut stickers and they were all individual, is there a way to have a split in the liner so that people can remove them easily? Or would you have to do a kiss cut sticker in order to remove it easily from the backer? Right now customers are getting stickers that we cut to 2" x 4" or whatever but it has a split back liner since our full sheet label stocks comes that way and I want to know if we can do something similar on our new wide format machine.

I know it exists, but I don't know what it is (brand). We had some one bring in a sample with the split backing looking for more stickers. We do a kiss cut, and sometimes a perf cut outside the kiss cut. But mostly just the kiss cut and cut them down individually by hand.

 

[victor bogdanov]

It is called crack and peel backing, I've used a label stock from canon that has the crack and peel backing - MSGLAB54300 - Canon #60 Semi Gloss Label Scores w/Perm Clear Adhesive. This one is made by MacTac, I think they have a ton of choices for label stock with crack and peel that comes on 30" + wide rolls

Another way I've seen done is to cut the backing on a flatbed cutter, can be done manually too by getting a vinyl cutter blade holder, setting the blade depth to where it will only cut the backing and then manually drag the knife across the backing

 

[Saturn]

Most "sticker" places don't offer crack and peel since they're using inkjets and plotters. As Victor mentioned, some flatbeds can do it, but I've only seen it done on a sheet, not a roll. (The flatbed uses its camera to register the corners of the sheet.) I've also seen folks go old school with a Rollem Champion.

Crack and peel seems perfect for paper or other non-shrinking material, but maybe not so much for calendared vinyl?

My observation is that you do get a small percentage of folks asking about back slits, but very few seem bothered by it not actually being an option. Kind of like all the gold foil I've had to tell folks they can't have... ;p

 

[InkHead]

I was actually looking into crack n peel/split back and how to accomplish this task this week. They are called Semi Slitters. Like Saturn mentioned, Rollem makes the Champion series but I think the Rollem SS slitter is probably the cheaper option.

There is another brand I believe from Pierce that is very similar to the Rollem SS. I'm assuming these probably go for $5k+ easy

 

[Saturn]

Yeah they look very similar. I worked a few print shops over the years that had one form or another. If you get really lucky you can find them for peanuts on Craigslist. They've been making them for a long time, and they're more or less bomb proof, or can be rehabbed. Perf, trim, score, all in one go if you need it.

My only fear with these is that complex die-cut stickers might be problematic to feed, and glossy finishes could be in danger of being marked. You're also more likely to see the slit "imprint" on the face side doing it this way, than if you had stock pre-slit.

If you're doing 1000's of rectangles and they're not "precious" the way merch stickers can sometimes be, then this would work reallywell.

 

[InkHead]

They do look very similar and I honestly don't know the difference between the 2. Maybe the SS slitter only does slitting and Champion adds perf and, score, trim,etc..

I'm also wondering how complex shape die cut stickers would work and if you would be able to feed smaller stickers through it with it skewing and flying across the room like a throwing star.

I've also wondered if you could be able to see a score mark from the face side. I wouldn't be too worried about the face being marked from running it through as I think it's like a die cylinder so I think you wouldn't see marks/scuffing. I do worry about seeing a score mark from the front though.

I did order an Olfa top sheet cutter yesterday to try back slitting. Sure it's a manual process but wantto try and see how it works as well as to see if it leaves the "score" on the face

 

[printhog]

there are a few manual options... aku-kut slitters are about $150, the yellotools slitter is about $40 and the olfa is about $15. I have all three in my kit.

Aku-kut is by far the best as you dial it to the paper backer thickness and it just slits to that depth, but you need a very flat table to do that successfully. The firm that sells these is http://www.densitometer.com/content/akukut.asp. Thye are exclusive. PITA to deal with.

The next best is the yellotools, http://www.yellotools.us/Cutting/Knives-Cutters-Scissors/BodyGuard-Knife.html which literally separates the liner from the decal to slit it, but you need to do that prior to print for small kiss-cut decals, its really made to prep out a tacking strip for wrapping work or for large decals.

The olfa https://www.amazon.com/Olfa-Top-Sheet-Cutter-TS-1/dp/B0044IPD06/ref=asc_df_B0044IPD06 is by far the least good as it relies on pressure, not depth. Its more hobbyist than pro. It can produce successful results but as it requires a "feel" to get it right so IMO it's no better than a skilled knifesman.

 

[InkHead]

The Aku-cut looks interesting does look like it would be accurate/quickest manual tool. I'll have to look at this a bit more.

I have the yellotools cutter but never thought of using it for this. I use it when I'm loading laminate into the laminator. I slit across maybe like 6 inches up the laminate liner across and then feed the laminate with the backing paper through the roller with the pressure down. That way I'm not fighting just the laminate film. It's perfect! Then u just peel up and attach the liner to the liner roller. Makes life so much easier.

Anyway Im going to look into the Aku-cut and keep searching for another solution where I don't have to break the bank

 

[Kemik]

At the risk of sounding like a complete fool, I've got a question about stickers. We are a commercial print shop and have done signs and posters, vinyl to mount to foamboards, etc. on our HP Latex for many years. We do mostly business to business work but since we are in a college town we also get quite a bit of "retail" work. We are getting a Mimaki UV printer/plotter installed this week and I want to gather some ideas for all the sellable products we will be capable of doing. This brought me to a question. We've been doing quite a few "stickers" on our digital press on die cut sheets of label stock (paper) like squares, rectangles and circles, and I'm hoping we can start to move some of this work onto our Mimaki with the ability to do custom cut stickers, clear stickers, etc.

My question is, if we did custom cut stickers and they were all individual, is there a way to have a split in the liner so that people can remove them easily? Or would you have to do a kiss cut sticker in order to remove it easily from the backer? Right now customers are getting stickers that we cut to 2" x 4" or whatever but it has a split back liner since our full sheet label stocks comes that way and I want to know if we can do something similar on our new wide format machine.

The Mimaki has a double cut feature where you can set the position and pressure of the first cut to just kiss cut the sticker, then you can offset the cut by 1/8" or what ever you choose and do a deeper perf cut to cut the liner, making the sticker removal easier and no need for a back slit.

 

[InkHead]

I'm assuming she is getting the UCJV. Yes it can double cut but if you are doing any volume, the UCJV is soooooo slow especially if you are doing any kind of complex cuts. We have one and we don't even use the cutter. If you have a summa or graphtec you will probably avoid the cutter on the mimaki.

With that being said, another option is adding a peel tab to the design and just kiss Cut a slit through the tab