Am I TOO picky? (Sign Blank Suppliers)

[Logoadv]

I realize I set pretty high standards for the work that I do, so maybe I expect too much from our suppliers, but I'll let you tell me. I've worked as the only graphic designer / sign shop employee at my current job for a little over 5 years now, so I see every sign that gets made and every blank or cut job that comes to us from our material supplier (Harbor Sales). Over the past year or so things have gotten so bad It's like a game to see how many attempts it will take for them to deliver a sign blank that isn't damaged in some way.

This one is fairly minor by comparison, as the corners weren't bent bad enough to come through the side of the box, but I can't possibly install vinyl on this and give it to a customer can I? Other people in the shop that work in other departments just say 'oh, they won't even notice once it is installed."....

Are all material suppliers this bad? We don't have a lot of options in our area and I think this is the only one who provides router cutting services. Maybe I'm just setting my expectations too high?

Btw, this is 6MM composite. Pretty heavy stuff.

 

[qmr55]

I deal with harbor almost exclusively for my substrate needs and rarely have those type of problems! Might be the delivery driver who delivers to your route versus happening in the warehouse. I know we've had a few times here and there where our driver is off and another driver delivers and I've had a problem those days in the past.

What does harbor say when you continually call and complain? Ask them to switch your location to another route....they might do that.

 

[BigfishDM]

That is the main reason I don't deal boards, they always get damaged in shipping, it's a joke!

 

[ColoPrinthead]

I'd refuse those unless I was going to be cutting it off as drop. I don't think you are being too picky. It is ACM though, can you flatten the non-busted edges back down?

 

[Logoadv]

Thanks. I suspected it was the delivery driver also, but we've had instances where the packaging was perfectly intact but the material inside was ruined.
I've had them replace a few jobs. Sometimes they send out the sales rep in his pickup truck to deliver instead of the delivery driver, and those are usually OK.

I don't think I can flatten the ACM enough since it has a crease in it. The other end has a smooth bend that I think I could flatten.
We get these cut to size because we don't have the equipment to do that in house, so cutting off the end isn't an option.

 

[rossmosh]

1. That material is damaged enough where you can return it.

2. You need to stop assuming that sheets are ready to go. There's a reason why plywood comes 49x97. It's because they assume you're going to saw it down to get clean edges. It's more work, but it's assumed. The same thing goes for ACM or any other material. Buying a 4x8 sheet you should assume it will have at least one bad corner or edge. Especially on cheap stuff (I consider cheap stuff anything under $150).

 

[d fleming]

Something small that can be cut down to perfect, cool. If you need the whole board, it goes back. Tubelite delivers to me twice weekly in their own truck. All their material comes flawless. Anyone else is a crapshoot. The courier service I use for other suppliers knows how picky I am and does me the service of not picking up damaged material when I send him.

 

[Logoadv]

1. That material is damaged enough where you can return it.

2. You need to stop assuming that sheets are ready to go. There's a reason why plywood comes 49x97. It's because they assume you're going to saw it down to get clean edges. It's more work, but it's assumed. The same thing goes for ACM or any other material. Buying a 4x8 sheet you should assume it will have at least one bad corner or edge. Especially on cheap stuff (I consider cheap stuff anything under $150).

I don't assume a 4'x8' is ready to go, though oddly enough most of those come with perfect corners. I do assume when I pay a material supplier to cut the material for us to 40" x 120" that it is in fact 40" x 120" and usable. I work in a shop that does embroidery, screen printing, signs, vehicle graphics, etc, and we simply don't have room in the shop for a router table or even a nice panel saw. Trust me, I wish we did.

 

[rossmosh]

I don't assume a 4'x8' is ready to go, though oddly enough most of those come with perfect corners. I do assume when I pay a material supplier to cut the material for us to 40" x 120" that it is in fact 40" x 120" and usable. I work in a shop that does embroidery, screen printing, signs, vehicle graphics, etc, and we simply don't have room in the shop for a router table or even a nice panel saw. Trust me, I wish we did.

I misunderstood that you had it cut to size. If they cut it to size, it should come without any edge damage. The whole point in paying them to cut is so you have a finished product.

I also deal with Harbor and I've dealt with other suppliers. I'd say the #1 issue with handling sheets like that is they're big and kind of heavy. So it's likely the driver or loader was left to do the job by themselves and as a result caused the damage.

 

[Gino]

Like mentioned, sometimes it won't matter, due to the scope of the work, but many times, we stress that we are using the entire sheet and flatbed printing it. Whether or not it's PVC, MDO, ACM or whatever, when you tell them, it should come as clean as possible and broke free..... it should. I've returned to all of them from local suppliers to Harbor, to Glantz and others. They all are incompetent when it comes to understanding.... if we pay for this sh!t, I want it right. I don't wanna hafta call, b!tch and wait for it to come a day or so later. I'm on a time schedule and don't have the luxury or just telling a customer..... oh, it came in wrong. Sometimes, I feel like I spend far too much time correcting my vendors faults. That shouldn't be.

 

[equippaint]

On pre-cut I'd say its totally reasonable to expect them in perfect condition, what you have is beyond a little mishandling. What irritates me is our supplier bands ACM sheets to a skid and we end up with big dents on the top sheet where the band went across. Or where the driver strapped it down to the trailer. The stuff is too delicate.

If it comes on the suppliers truck or by LTL make sure you inspect it before the driver leaves or you have a big chance of being stuck with it. If its by LTL, send it back with the driver. We just went through a big ordeal with 26' long alum extrusions that were mangled, driver saw it too but we unloaded them, essentially accepting it and got stuck. It took 3 shipments and almost a month to get an undamaged set.

 

[Oroscoe]

Call and notify them every time it happens. Take pictures and send emails. If it is happening in their warehouse they will get another material handler. If it is not happening in the warehouse then it must be the delivery person. In that case they will either correct the driver or get someone else. have them pick up the damaged piece and replace it. They want you to get material free of defects as their to keep from having to absorb costs due to negligence.

 

[FireSprint.com]

That's always a challenge. We try hard to get enough material from our suppliers per order that they have no choice but to stack it on a pallet. Even if we don't need a full pallet of material, we'll order enough different materials all at once that it comes on a pallet.

If I order a single sheet, I pretty much expect there to be some small amounts of damage around the edges.

 

[Dennis422]

I do not deal much with a MaxMetal or similar boards, but every time I order them from Grimco they come in perfect.
They pre-cut and deliver. One of their locations is about 20 miles away and they do deliveries every day.

And no, you are not too picky, they should come without any damage.

 

[TravinFlavin]

I don't assume a 4'x8' is ready to go, though oddly enough most of those come with perfect corners. I do assume when I pay a material supplier to cut the material for us to 40" x 120" that it is in fact 40" x 120" and usable. I work in a shop that does embroidery, screen printing, signs, vehicle graphics, etc, and we simply don't have room in the shop for a router table or even a nice panel saw. Trust me, I wish we did.

Not trying to undermine the issue, because you certainly should be dealing with that kind of crap for precut substrate. But just for your info, incase you didn't know, ACM can actually be cut fairly easily with an Olfa knife and a straight edge. You don't need a table/panel saw.

 

[WrapYourCar]

Comp panel cuts pretty easy with a basic knife and ruler / bend n snap. Just buy it in bulk and cut it down yourself. Sheets should be much cheaper, you could even import them yourself.

 

[WrapYourCar]

That's pretty awful quality.. my suppliers do a much better job than what you've got there... amateurs.

 

[Joe House]

From a supplier's (who runs delivery trucks) point of view, it happens. Unfortunately, the people we hire to do delivery and work in the warehouse tend to be those looking for jobs. These are entry level positions and it takes time to train and/or weed out the ones who will not cut it. Here's how I would recommend that you handle this:
Inspect it when it comes in.
If there's a problem, make the driver wait while you call back to the office and talk to someone who cares and understands (not saying that the driver doesn't care, but if they're delivering things this way they at least don't understand). Tie them both up till a solution is figured out and you determine that the stuff (most likely) will just need to be loaded back on the truck and you'll get your product on the next delivery.
On our end, we will do everything we can to keep this from happening in the future because, as pointed out above, we don't want to have the expense of the whole ordeal. We will work on educating the drivers, warehouse staff, etc on the importance of pristine products. When you hold the driver there, it has a lot more impact on him than us telling them. He'll start being your advocate if he's the type who'll stick around. He won't accept things on his truck that are damaged. If he messes it up during the run, he'll point it out before he unloads it.
I realize that this can take some time out of your day, but it will pay dividends in the future. It can turn into a win/win for all involved.

 

[ddarlak]

There's a reason why plywood comes 49x97

I have been in the sign business since 1986 and I have NEVER once seen a piece of plywood come in that size.

Where do you get such an animal?

 

[asd]

i don't think you are being too picky, we also have that problem with pre cut aluminum when the ups driver delivers it, all of our acm panels get deliver to us by our supplier, we get materials from harbor too, but the others are big enough that usually get shipped in a pallet.