Correct PAINT for Vinyl applied to walls?

[splizaat]

Hey Guys...for the last eight years we have been doing a TON of wall installs. Some wall stick like a dream, and some are pesky as hell to get the transfer tape off without pulling the vinyl off.

We're using 651 direct applied to the wall in most cases (this isn't up for debate), and have never had an install FAIL or come off, but there are times where installs don't go smooth as others due to the type of paint used on the walls.

My question is, has anyone actually narrowed down what kind of paints that vinyl stick best to? The only thing that vinyl seems to adhere to better is MATTE finish paint. Anything glossy takes us ten times as long to install to. But I don't know if that's just luck. These are all indoor installs on walls of businesses...always looking for better ideas

 

[eahicks]

We run into this all the time as well. I don't know what the answer is. I've had success on matte, gloss, satin, and then had failures on all, too.
We primarily will use a cast vinyl, and what we've found to help installing is to take our trusty torches and rivet brushes with us. Once all is stuck to the wall, leave the mask up and heat the vinyl and rub with the brushes. Time consuming as all get out when it's all a bunch of small text, but works well.

 

[splizaat]

exactly. The problem is that when we do get a wall that REALLY sticks well, we try asking the business owner and 100% of the time they hired a painter and have no idea what paint it is.

My only observation so far has been that vinyl sticks far better to matte paint over gloss paint.

We've never had one failure ever, but it's just so time consuming on the walls that don't stick. As long as we can get the transfer tape off (leaving vinyl on the wall) it's all good -- but sometimes that process takes an hour. Once the transfer tape is off, heatgun and dabbing with felt squeegee is the ticket for us. I'd like to KNOW and suggest to customers what paint to use for better results though.

 

[eahicks]

I hear ya...unfortunately, we are at their mercy usually and have no say in the painting process they choose. We gets what we gets.

 

[fozzie]

here is a pdf from avery. couple good pages on paint. they have gloss as best, flat as worst.

 

[tbullo]

I have rarely had any success on flat painted walls. We always suggest satin or semi-gloss.

 

[MakeMyGraphic]

I've had decent success when using low tack paper type transfer tapes, of course you have to pre-release the graphic prior to install, but it works very well... I also try and avoid matte or flat paint since sometimes the type of paint is chalky and picks up dust particles easier. Maybe I'm just crazy but that's what I've experienced :\

 

[Pixels Are Bad Mmmkay?]

here is a pdf from avery. couple good pages on paint. they have gloss as best, flat as worst.

This is generally accepted as the correct answer and from my experience it is typically true. I'm surprised that a matte finish works better as gloss and semi-gloss finishes work the best for us with gloss offering the best adhesion. I wouldn't even try a matte or flat finish without testing some vinyl and transfer tape on it first. What type of transfer tape are you using? Ideally you want Oratape HT55 with 631. We also always post heat and burnish with a felt squeegee before removing the film and after where necessary.

 

[Sign Works]

Low tack transfer tape.

 

[splizaat]

low tack transfer tape may be the ticket...as of now we're just using the standard 16-18oz tack and I suppose it may be time to start carrying another roll of something with less tack.

Any recommended low tack brands?

 

[player]

Have you tried wetting it down with Rapid Tac, then removing the tape?

 

[splizaat]

yes and that absolutely helps every time...we started doing that a couple years ago

 

[StopSignGraphics]

The best answer I received was from a chemist, I have no idea if its true. Some paints have additives that help make it mark resistant. The additives tend to be some sort of silicon product. The adhesive on most vinyl is designed not to stick to silicon.

Not all paints are "smudge" proof. The ones marked smudge proof tend to make the vinyl fail. To complicate the issue, the additives that make the paint "smudge proof" break down over time allowing the vinyl to stick better. Also UV light can accelerate the break down of the smudge resistance. That's why some walls will work at the same location and others fail, more uv exposure or the some walls have a fresher coat of paint.

Again, I have no idea if it's true, but it sounds plausible.

~Chris

 

[splizaat]

Well I'm glad to know I'm not the only one who sees no consistency in what paints work and don't work