Suggestions Foamboard install

[d fleming]

Just used a little trick on a problem job. Hope it might help someone with future installs of this type. Had to install quite a few 1/2" foam board graphics at a retail store. All using scissor lift. VHB tape and silicone to hang. Done it this way a long time with no issues. Well, about half of them fell the first night. Turns out the contractor had to put 5 coats of paint on the sheet rock to cover maroon with orange. Guessing that was the problem. Maybe not, who knows. The silicone simply would not cure. Not all the vhb worked either. Replaced damaged signs this morning, switched to oracal tape instead of 3m because the 3m just didn't feel very tacky to the touch. Oracal did. That stuff is serious. This time I took some small rivets, cut the heads so they would not go all the way through the board, drilled the wall at tops of each sign for rivets to be push in to the sheet rock. The collars on the rivets worked to stop the rivet from going any further into the wall than needed. Pushed the signs on to the rivets with a ridiculous amount of tape on the back. Those jokers are staying. Happy Turkey Day Y'all.

 

[BPSAFF]

Just used a little trick on a problem job. Hope it might help someone with future installs of this type. Had to install quite a few 1/2" foam board graphics at a retail store. All using scissor lift. VHB tape and silicone to hang. Done it this way a long time with no issues. Well, about half of them fell the first night. Turns out the contractor had to put 5 coats of paint on the sheet rock to cover maroon with orange. Guessing that was the problem. Maybe not, who knows. The silicone simply would not cure. Not all the vhb worked either. Replaced damaged signs this morning, switched to oracal tape instead of 3m because the 3m just didn't feel very tacky to the touch. Oracal did. That stuff is serious. This time I took some small rivets, cut the heads so they would not go all the way through the board, drilled the wall at tops of each sign for rivets to be push in to the sheet rock. The collars on the rivets worked to stop the rivet from going any further into the wall than needed. Pushed the signs on to the rivets with a ridiculous amount of tape on the back. Those jokers are staying. Happy Turkey Day Y'all.

Glad to hear other people have issues with VHB tape. Not dependable at all so we stopped using it. Where do you get the Oracal tape?

 

[d fleming]

Fellers. Got the one inch roll. Frank actually answered the phone. That's a first for me.

 

[signbrad]

contractor had to put 5 coats of paint on the sheet rock to cover maroon with orange.

Did you happen to learn what brand and what line of wall paint the contractor used? This would be good to know.

The coatings industry has been experiencing lots of innovation the past few years. Some new coatings are very resistant to adhesives. Waterborne coatings have advanced far beyond the latex paints of the past. Some of them are very aggressive and seem to get rock hard. I used a waterborne Sherwin Williams primer that was recommended as a good primer for a painted wall job I did on a textured metal building that had factory paint on it, presumably a tough finish. An adhesion test the next day with Gorilla tape would not pull the paint off the wall. It was very impressive. At 65 dollars a gallon the price was impressive, too.

Whether or not the painted finish was the culprit on dfleming's job, a mechanical fastener is good insurance.

Brad in Kansas City

 

[d fleming]

It was sherwin williams. I don't have the exact specs with me but I will post it after the holiday. I got the rgb spec for it from their site to try to match oranges in the art to wall but when printed wasn't even close. Turned out ok as customer liked the contrast thank goodness.

 

[Modern Ink Signs]

another wall install gone bad!

When doing a wall install graphics, letters etc, you have to know a few things

- What type of paint used / manufacturer?
With the low VOC paints being used you have to know what will work what mounting

- Primed?
Primed helps the paint stick to the wall not your project!

- When was it painted?
You should allow 30+ days for the paint to out gas

- How many coats?
With each coat added you need to add at least 1 week per coat. Again, out gas time.

 

[Jester1167]

I've had to lightly sand wall to create a tooth for vinyl to stick to. They putting lots of silicone and plasticizers into paints these days so they last and are cleanable. Not good for us sign guys

You know you have a problem when your trying to tape your graphic in position and the tape won't hold.

 

[HandsomeBob]

It's the paint. In the last few years chemicals have been added to some paint to make them child/graffiti resistant. As a result the surface resists double sided tape, including VHB. The only solution i have found is to sand the surface before application of the sign.

You can usually tell this kind of paint from it glossiness and a slightly slick feeling to the surface

 

[bowtievega]

We have typically not had good luck with VHB tape on anything painted with latex paint. If you are using a secondary adhesive like silicone then the need for a permanent bonding tape is not really there. Plain old two sided foam tape seems to adhere better in those situations. We use VHB tape as a replacement for adhesive or rivets in some instances. You just need to be careful on using the correct VHB tape for the application. They have so many different VHB tape adhesives available that are suited for different surfaces, make sure you use the right one for what you are doing. Some people also might not realize that VHB tape needs a certain amount of pressure when applied to activate the adhesive properly, tough to do with soft substrates sometimes.

 

[eahicks]

Yep...paints are bad these days. We have a large vet chain we do all their interior signage for, including wall murals. We have now gotten them to omit painting the walls for murals when they do their build-outs. It has helped tremendously, as the first few we installed were after the fact, and sure enough, the wall murals all began to peel off within a week. Their stain-proof, scuff-proof, bullet-proof paint was so bad that masking tape wouldn't stay. We had to spray the walls down with alcohol to make them tacky, and even used banner tape along top edges to keep them from falling.
As far as tape mounting things like dimensional letters, etc. to walls with these paints already, we do the same....alcohol where the tape will go, even sometimes sand down the area where the tape will go.

 

[Marlene]

Yep...paints are bad these days. We have a large vet chain we do all their interior signage for, including wall murals. We have now gotten them to omit painting the walls for murals when they do their build-outs. It has helped tremendously, as the first few we installed were after the fact, and sure enough, the wall murals all began to peel off within a week. Their stain-proof, scuff-proof, bullet-proof paint was so bad that masking tape wouldn't stay. We had to spray the walls down with alcohol to make them tacky, and even used banner tape along top edges to keep them from falling.
As far as tape mounting things like dimensional letters, etc. to walls with these paints already, we do the same....alcohol where the tape will go, even sometimes sand down the area where the tape will go.

we started having issues with paint and talked to a 3M rep. they know about the additives in paints but their excuse is there are so many type of paint with them that they aren't researching a solution. sounds like the maybe Oracal has done the work so maybe we'll give it a try too.

 

[2B]

d fleming

are you using the Orafol ORABOND 1397PP?
this has some serious stick and IMO better than 3M

 

[d fleming]

oracal uhb 3600 what it says on box, significant adhesive over the 3m no doubt.