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Halo Letters

3Dsigns

3Dsigns

New Member
Does anyone have any tips on making Halo letters from HDU and/or 1"pvc and LED strips "tape" like Grimco sells?

Do the backs of the letters need to be hollowed out?
If so, how deep and wide?
How far do you stand them off?
What size LED's
Does a piece of clear acrylic or something need to be inset in the backs of letters to more evenly diffuse light?
Anything else pertinent?
Thanks so much!
Wayne
 
Zendavor Signs

Zendavor Signs

Mmmmm....signs
3Dsigns said:
Does anyone have any tips on making Halo letters from HDU and/or 1"pvc and LED strips "tape" like Grimco sells?

Do the backs of the letters need to be hollowed out?
If so, how deep and wide?
How far do you stand them off?
What size LED's
Does a piece of clear acrylic or something need to be inset in the backs of letters to more evenly diffuse light?
Anything else pertinent?
Thanks so much!
Wayne
Click to expand...

It sounds like you have never made these kinds of letters before. I would recommend you wholesale them out a few times and study the finished letters closely so you can learn how to do it yourself. I would definitely not recommend using PVC or HDU for backlit lettering. I would be concerned it is a fire hazard. They are typically made from aluminum or stainless steel.

That being said, if you are going to strike out on your own, the first question is YES the letters need to be hollowed out so the LED lights are hidden. All the other questions depend on overall size, etc. Can you submit a drawing with sizes?
 
ams

ams

New Member
The standard stand off depth is 1 1/2". By making this yourself, putting in LEDs and trying to sell it, you will run into UL violation laws. Also you won't be able to get them inspected because they won't have UL labels.
 
3Dsigns

3Dsigns

New Member
ams said:
The standard stand off depth is 1 1/2". By making this yourself, putting in LEDs and trying to sell it, you will run into UL violation laws. Also you won't be able to get them inspected because they won't have UL labels.
Click to expand...

Ok, sounds about right. I just want to be able to build some into my new shop sign/s for now. I just cut this one out on my CNC foamcutter.

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And these are the graphics which I will make on my router...

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The LED's I have are encased in a plastic "tape", are 12V, waterproof, and put out virtually no heat.
 

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3Dsigns

3Dsigns

New Member
Zendavor Signs said:
It sounds like you have never made these kinds of letters before. I would recommend you wholesale them out a few times and study the finished letters closely so you can learn how to do it yourself. I would definitely not recommend using PVC or HDU for backlit lettering. I would be concerned it is a fire hazard. They are typically made from aluminum or stainless steel.

That being said, if you are going to strike out on your own, the first question is YES the letters need to be hollowed out so the LED lights are hidden. All the other questions depend on overall size, etc. Can you submit a drawing with sizes?
Click to expand...

This is a JPG, I can send an EPS if needed. The main copy is 10" high, secondary is 4", probably wouldn't halo it.

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ams

ams

New Member
3Dsigns said:
Ok, sounds about right. I just want to be able to build some into my new shop sign/s for now. I just cut this one out on my CNC foamcutter.


And these are the graphics which I will make on my router...

The LED's I have are encased in a plastic "tape", are 12V, waterproof, and put out virtually no heat.
Click to expand...

For yourself it's ok, just make sure a UL tech doesn't catch you. Not saleable to the public.
 
signage

signage

New Member
ams said:
For yourself it's ok, just make sure a UL tech doesn't catch you. Not saleable to the public.
Click to expand...


How can you say this? What if it catches fire and damages an other structure he owns and is insured, and they find out that the sign was not UL approved and inspected/stamped?
 
B

BIG EASY DOES IT

New Member
signage said:
How can you say this? What if it catches fire and damages an other structure he owns and is insured, and they find out that the sign was not UL approved and inspected/stamped?
Click to expand...



Isn't this like making something at your house. I could make an electrical sign in my garage for my house. Does this need to be UL inspected and stamped.
 
3Dsigns

3Dsigns

New Member
signage said:
How can you say this? What if it catches fire and damages an other structure he owns and is insured, and they find out that the sign was not UL approved and inspected/stamped?
Click to expand...

I wired my 2-story house, this office, the shop, All the way from the entrance cables, weatherhead, meter and service panel to the last wall receptacle; 220V, 110v and some 3 phase all legally. I designed, built and wired this hotwire foamcutting machine. Nothing has caught fire. The foam sign these LEDS are being installed on is about 40' away from any building, the LED's are already encased in a waterproof plastic sheath which has the potential to melt/burn but does not because the LED's burn cool AND the cottonpicking thing is low current 12V DC powered through a GFCI receptacle: it ain't gonna catch on fire...
Note: I'n NOT advocating anyone bypass legal proceedures, but some of these "UL Listed" Made in USA guys need to tighten up!:thumb: :wavingflag:
 
R

rossmosh

New Member
LEDs are one of the safest types of lights you can use. Assuming you have basic common sense, you shouldn't run into any issues. This isn't legal advice but simply practical advice.

With halo lights, you're going to want to play with the distance from LED to back surface. Put the letters on threaded rods and allow them to be adjustable to some degree until you get it right. Then glue them in permanently when you're happy.
 
3Dsigns

3Dsigns

New Member
Come to think of it, a couple years ago I ordered a 4x8 electric sign from a company in Birmingham, AL. Got the thing to the shop and it would not light. So I pulled the ballast, changed it out, same thing. Replaced a second ballast, nope. I ended up pulling the retainers off the ends and low and behold, found where some Einstein had tried to cram six(6) wires into one of those teenieweenie little orange wire nuts; two of the wires had fallen out....Stamped right on the cabinet was "UL Listed". I put a larger nut on it ans she works fine.

Right now I'm dealing with another UL Listed cabinet where the manufacturer installed two EMC's in the bottom but forgot to install any ventilation in the main cabinet; not even a hole. The cabinet temp rises to egg-cooking temp and the displays cut off. I know it's not a photocell doing it because I wired the photocell myself on a separate circuit from the displays. It was working fine in the winter, except for when the heavy condensation inside (also because of no ventilation) caused the main LED panel to fry. They're building me a new one as we speak BTW. Just because it's UL Listed doesn't necessarily mean it was done right; just means it was legal. :)
 
Z SIGNS

Z SIGNS

New Member
3Dsigns said:
I wired my 2-story house, this office, the shop, All the way from the entrance cables, weatherhead, meter and service panel to the last wall receptacle; 220V, 110v and some 3 phase all legally. I designed, built and wired this hotwire foamcutting machine. Nothing has caught fire. The foam sign these LEDS are being installed on is about 40' away from any building, the LED's are already encased in a waterproof plastic sheath which has the potential to melt/burn but does not because the LED's burn cool AND the cottonpicking thing is low current 12V DC powered through a GFCI receptacle: it ain't gonna catch on fire...sheesh. :)
Click to expand...

Sounds like you know what you are doing but sorry that does not mean jack to UL or the local electrical inspector.
Give that spiel to an electrical or UL inspector and he would laugh at you.In fact I am laughing at you while reading your post
Yes you can do it,more than likely get away with it,and yes the likely hood of a fire is remote.

Also there is more to making effective halo lit letters.You are not going to find the answers here you will have to your home work..
Hollowing out a letter and sticking some cheap chinese leds in there is not the way the pro's do it.
That's a cheap cheesy looking way to do it.Gives you a sort of a halo along with ugly hot spots when viewed at the slightest angle.

Order a letter from someone like gemini and then study it would be a good start.
 
R

rossmosh

New Member
Z SIGNS said:
Sounds like you know what you are doing but sorry that does not mean jack to UL or the local electrical inspector.
Give that spiel to an electrical or UL inspector and he would laugh at you.In fact I am laughing at you while reading your post
Yes you can do it,more than likely get away with it,and yes the likely hood of a fire is remote.

Also there is more to making effective halo lit letters.You are not going to find the answers here you will have to your home work..
Hollowing out a letter and sticking some cheap chinese leds in there is not the way the pro's do it.
That's a cheap cheesy looking way to do it.Gives you a sort of a halo along with ugly hot spots when viewed at the slightest angle.

Order a letter from someone like gemini and then study it would be a good start.
Click to expand...

Probably the best advice on the thread.

Also Google image search is great. Something like this: http://www.channelletterdepot.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/channel-Letters_diagrams2_side-new.jpg should prove somewhat helpful.
 
3Dsigns

3Dsigns

New Member
Z SIGNS said:
Sounds like you know what you are doing but sorry that does not mean jack to UL or the local electrical inspector.
Give that spiel to an electrical or UL inspector and he would laugh at you.In fact I am laughing at you while reading your post
Yes you can do it,more than likely get away with it,and yes the likely hood of a fire is remote.

Also there is more to making effective halo lit letters.You are not going to find the answers here you will have to your home work..
Hollowing out a letter and sticking some cheap chinese leds in there is not the way the pro's do it.
That's a cheap cheesy looking way to do it.Gives you a sort of a halo along with ugly hot spots when viewed at the slightest angle.

Order a letter from someone like gemini and then study it would be a good start.
Click to expand...

Thanks brother, you have a good night. :thumb:
 
ams

ams

New Member
signage said:
How can you say this? What if it catches fire and damages an other structure he owns and is insured, and they find out that the sign was not UL approved and inspected/stamped?
Click to expand...

That is the chance you take when you don't do things by the book. But I don't support it.
 
visual800

visual800

Active Member
it doesnt take but a second to get off the main topic...

anyway, back to your sign. I went o Blockwire and picked up a sign, similiar the monument you had and they guy showed me around and showed me these tiny led lights encased in a clear tube and how he could cut a groove in the hdu and do exactly what you were taling about. I had never seen little leds like this before
 
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