Just Can't Catch a Break...

[WildWestDesigns]

"Ad" or "tip"?: Article

The phrasing of the "tip", in my mind would be an "ad", but that could just be me.

 

[JBurton]

That's the most disingenuous thing I've heard in a long time. Maybe I can use this argument when dealing with permits. It's not advertising anything, this is just a tip for anybody driving past this mcdonalds...

 

[Pauly]

Microsoft will cause the death of itself with all these add injections into everything.

Every day there's something new i disslike about windows.
The only issue for me is there is a few apps i still rely on which dont run linux - Adobe is one.
More and more people leaving windows for Linux or giving it ago and realise "It just works"

 

[WildWestDesigns]

The only issue for me is there is a few apps i still rely on which dont run linux - Adobe is one.

I've been a user of Linux for just about 20 yrs (18 actually). What I would suggest, is not thinking about can it run program X, but can it do function Y. What functionality do you need from the adobe program(s) that you are using and can the alternatives do that to the level that you can still get the job done. There are quite a few alternatives for Adobe and with the web being used more and more (shoot even Adobe programs have bundled Chromium in their programs), cross platform is less of a concern. About the only good thing that has come out of the modern web, I have even used it for just the UI portion of my C/C++ tooling, but all still local. The one thing that won't be able to be replicated is how seamless one can use each individual Adobe program with another one. That was always the thing that I had liked about Adobe since having been a user since the early 90s. That has gotten better on the Linux side, but still not at that level.

When I switched, my hold back program was an embroidery digitizing program. Only on Windows, no Mac version, their recommendation was a VM and we are talking $15k for one program, not a suite. It took awhile, but no need now, got something that does everything that I need (including some rare functionality as well that most don't need, but I would). While there is always WINE (Mac has a commercial variant of that same program, which can happen in OSS, nothing in the licensing prevents that) and I had heard that got better running Adobe programs, there isn't going to be the ability to run it directly and probably never well. It never worked great for those that had to deal with dongles either (like aforementioned digitizing program). DRAW was the only one that had a Linux variant for time and I highly doubt outside of Substance Painter, Adobe will do this.

 

[Pauly]

I've been a user of Linux for just about 20 yrs (18 actually). What I would suggest, is not thinking about can it run program X, but can it do function Y. What functionality do you need from the adobe program(s) that you are using and can the alternatives do that to the level that you can still get the job done. There are quite a few alternatives for Adobe and with the web being used more and more (shoot even Adobe programs have bundled Chromium in their programs), cross platform is less of a concern. About the only good thing that has come out of the modern web, I have even used it for just the UI portion of my C/C++ tooling, but all still local. The one thing that won't be able to be replicated is how seamless one can use each individual Adobe program with another one. That was always the thing that I had liked about Adobe since having been a user since the early 90s. That has gotten better on the Linux side, but still not at that level.

When I switched, my hold back program was an embroidery digitizing program. Only on Windows, no Mac version, their recommendation was a VM and we are talking $15k for one program, not a suite. It took awhile, but no need now, got something that does everything that I need (including some rare functionality as well that most don't need, but I would). While there is always WINE (Mac has a commercial variant of that same program, which can happen in OSS, nothing in the licensing prevents that) and I had heard that got better running Adobe programs, there isn't going to be the ability to run it directly and probably never well. It never worked great for those that had to deal with dongles either (like aforementioned digitizing program). DRAW was the only one that had a Linux variant for time and I highly doubt outside of Substance Painter, Adobe will do this.

For most people, replacing adobe is easy.

For users like me, it can be challenging.
E.g Acrobat pro.

We use Enfocus Switch, Griffin, Pitstop Pro and Server. that runs on Windows Server.
Griffin desktop runs on win and mac, so does Pitstop Pro.
Pitstop pro needs Acrobat which is a plugin.
Griffin is a GUI nesting software which helps us create our automations for nesting.
We use the GUI to get the output we need then we get the config into Switch automations.

Quite frustrating.

I will eventually move those to a VM, they're not daily used.
Windows server is at least not full of bloat and bs apps. so its manageable.

I do have and use Linux alternatives for a few things, but they're all self hosted in docker so all web apps.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

For most people, replacing adobe is easy.

For users like me, it can be challenging.
E.g Acrobat pro.

We use Enfocus Switch, Griffin, Pitstop Pro and Server. that runs on Windows Server.
Griffin desktop runs on win and mac, so does Pitstop Pro.
Pitstop pro needs Acrobat which is a plugin.
Griffin is a GUI nesting software which helps us create our automations for nesting.
We use the GUI to get the output we need then we get the config into Switch automations.

Quite frustrating.

I will eventually move those to a VM, they're not daily used.
Windows server is at least not full of bloat and bs apps. so its manageable.

I do have and use Linux alternatives for a few things, but they're all self hosted in docker so all web apps.

All of those are related to each other, I think all of those apps you mentioned are Enfocus apps and most are centered around Acrobat workflows.

Maybe a rough commercial alternatives that would be for Linux would be Apryse, OSS would be Apache Airflow. Not exact, but those would be the closest that I would figure on.

I despise Docker, I really do. Put Golang (I like it OK, it has it's perks) on the map, but I just don't like running things in that type of environment. Docker can be used for both native and web apps though. Some use it as a means for cross compilation.

 

[Pauly]

All of those are related to each other, I think all of those apps you mentioned are Enfocus apps and most are centered around Acrobat workflows.

Maybe a rough commercial alternatives that would be for Linux would be Apryse, OSS would be Apache Airflow. Not exact, but those would be the closest that I would figure on.

I despise Docker, I really do. Put Golang (I like it OK, it has it's perks) on the map, but I just don't like running things in that type of environment. Docker can be used for both native and web apps though. Some use it as a means for cross compilation.

They're all enfocus apps, Yes. to Design PDF workflows Pitstop pro need to be ran in Acrobat with a plugin to see results.

We are building something where Switch might go and maybe pitstop (replaced with something else) but still need griffin (windows/mac)

I really like docker, took be time to get around it but i love it.
Run apps in its own env, or stacks. I have nightly backups and if something happens i can very easily restore any container. I use a lot of webapps so access anywhere on any computer is great.

Personally, I hope windows dies. most good apps work on linus anyway. gaming community showing more support. More and more linux alternative apps are showing up, the Self hosted apps (docker) are pretty wild for those who want to host and especially for businesses.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

Personally, I hope windows dies. most good apps work on linus anyway.

I don't think it will ever die. Maybe for the end users like us it may, but their biggest customer(s) are big business. Even some end users won't change because Windows is what they know (I'm old enough to remember when MS had a Unix-like OS), to me, it peaked with Win 98. It was at it's most powerful (for end user mucking about, not necessarily computational power) and the UI got out of the way.

About the biggest boon of Electron (or just using the frontend for a GUI stack even for otherwise local apps) is that most browsers are cross platform to begin with. For some things, I'll use the web for a gui for my C/C++ apps, run it as a desktop app or have it able to also be broadcast over the LAN so any computer that's connected can also use it app as long as it's open and running from at least one computer. Unlike Electron, the app takes up about 1-5MB (depending on what all assets are bundled in) and that is even statically linking to musl, fully static binary (just a sys call to the browser/webview to run a minified/app instance). I just cry a little seeing that RAM usage go up. I can handle it when it comes to non trivial apps, even apps that don't use the browser context, even for just the GUI can take up the same or more resources.

gaming community showing more support.

Ironically most game engines always had a Linux export. It was mainly kernel level anticheat (which is a horrible thing, but I digress). I've gotten more into homebrew for retro consoles (GB/NES, wrote a couple for game jams, that will actually run on original hardware or on something like the pocket), so I actually tend to focus on that. I prefer the indie homebrew scene.

 

[bdw99]

O&O shut up is a great software for the annoyances of windows.. At the end of the day windows is windows but this does make it better.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

O&O shut up is a great software for the annoyances of windows.. At the end of the day windows is windows but this does make it better.

Some huge problems with this, at least from my perspective.

First and foremost, there shouldn't be a need for something like this. While the average user wouldn't probably ever go beyond what is easily accessible in the usual GUI places (given current generation abilities with computers and the fear that they have with even the CLI), the options should still be there for those that are motivated to harden their system(s) as they choose.

When I see programs like this what are they using to aid in this (for instance, if they use as part of it, the host file, well MS has largely been ignoring those entries since the shut up win 10 upgrade days) helps to if they are OSS especially considering that they are doing some system level changes I would prefer to be able to vet it, does it strip anything out (running the risk of castrating functionality due to how everything is tied to one another) or does it just make changes that can be changed on the next update and have to be reapplied and if they still work and the update didn't change how they were handled. Also, if they aren't stripping out, it would seem to be only doing things that an individual could do, so while time consuming initially, it would honestly be better for the end user to be more familiar with their system and not rely on a 3rd party tool. I understand the convenience factor, ironically talking about security concerns, convenience and security rarely, if at all, go together. Security isn't really something that we should be delegating to others for every little thing (in some cases yes, but a lot of people delegate everything to someone else and that's were it gets hinky), we have seen too many breaches (and those are just the ones that we know about, imagine how many are still under wraps), no one is going to care about as much as the person that is directly affected.

The above software could still be very good and worth using for those that are still on Windows (I haven't been since Win 7 was new), these are just some things (and more) that I would look at if I'm trying to vet something for security.