Media Suggestion

[congerc1977]

Hello, I am interested to know, has anyone found a consistent well priced grey back perm. adhesive gloss or matte? Short term indoor/outdoor, nothing special. I tried IJ10 and IJ11 and I am far from happy. If you do have one to recommend, how much is it currently?

Thank you,

 

[Tommy_]

How about Oracal 3641G.

 

[congerc1977]

That is a good product but the price point is above the IJ10 correct? Around .18 psf?

 

[Tommy_]

Yes it is around $.18 psf. For the price it's a very good product for short term.

 

[congerc1977]

Thank you! I will try it. I don't know why a company like 3M even put their name on low end products. I was not happy with it.

 

[congerc1977]

At this price point was is the purpose of name brand? Cheap Brightline, Key, or other China product will do the trick wont it?

 

[Gino]

It's not a good idea to print your prices of media out here where end-users can see it.

It might not affect you personally, but it can hurt others somewhere.


Try not to discuss pricing of any sorts like this where anyone can see these things.


Not to mention, based upon your profile, what are you doing anyway ??

You already know this kinda stuff. Sounds like you should stop fishing and either join as a Merchant Member or state your real reasons.

 

[bob]

It's not a good idea to print your prices of media out here where end-users can see it...

Really? What then of all the mewing 'Perceived Value' enthusiasts cruising these waters?

If the doctrine of 'Perceived Value' is valid then what possible difference would it make if some civilian or another was cognizant of the price of vinyl? Vinyl being but one ingredient among many used to produce a product. Would you guard the price of application tape, knife blades, ink, masking tape, etc. as jealously?

Could it be that the notion of 'Perceived Value' has no clothes? That the only one perceiving the sort of value you want to be perceived is the sign maker?

 

[TwoNine]

Not to mention, based upon your profile, what are you doing anyway ??

You already know this kinda stuff. Sounds like you should stop fishing and either join as a Merchant Member or state your real reasons.

Mmmm Hmmm....

 

[BigfishDM]

Your profile says your a media distributor and you don't know these answers? Looks like your trolling and that's gonna make you look bad and if you really do distribute media then keep it up please! What company do you work for?

Did you order the code red!?

 

[Scott Reynolds]

Just looked at their web site.

http://www.precision.com/

 

[congerc1977]

Yes, that is the older site. There is also three other beta sites for the change over and new product offerings. We are located in Grand Rapids, MI and we are getting into the distribution of media and hardware. That is why I joined this forum to ask questions and learn about the business. I have not once tried to "pedal" anything to anyone. Only the current members put our site in the posting. I am doing what I am paid to do...learn the business' that we serve. This information was for ME and done on MY time. I am fishing for anything. I put my company information and intentions very clearly upon registration. Also, the site you pointed out has nothing to do with the sign business. It is the parent company and this was intentional as to not use the forum for anything short of learning.

A very respected company referred me to this site to ask questions and learn. If I had known that this would be met with such a defensive and hostile group I would not have bothered. The manufacturers will gladly advise me going forward. I have found that it is usually best to learn from people in a business rather than those asking us to promote their products. That was clearly a mistake as some of you are obviously offended that someone would want to openly ask questions or learn anything. Again I NEVER pushed any product! The question posed was one I had after visiting of the beta test sites and seeing them using 3M product on what they called a "cheap" job. Later I wondered why anyone would do that. I apologize for the question, I will gladly learn elsewhere.

 

[Fred Weiss]

Congratulations. Another new member (potential MM) run off by self appointed troll police.

:signs101:

 

[Tommy_]

Anyone can get their hands on vinyl prices. All they need to do is stop by any vinyl supplier and get a catalog.

But what gets me mad is when a Large Printing Company sells to an end customer at a lower price than what i pay wholesale when i sub out work.

Just lost two big contracts to Lowen and later to find out that the end customer is paying $1.25 psf on 3M vinyl. Now you tell me how is this possible.

In my 4 years in this business I could never get a wholesale price this cheap no matter what material was used.

It's not a good idea to print your prices of media out here where end-users can see it.

It might not affect you personally, but it can hurt others somewhere.


Try not to discuss pricing of any sorts like this where anyone can see these things.


Not to mention, based upon your profile, what are you doing anyway ??

You already know this kinda stuff. Sounds like you should stop fishing and either join as a Merchant Member or state your real reasons.

 

[Gino]

I don't consider protecting my business, my interests and the interests of others in this industry [or this site] as troll police. We have an industry and the pertinent costs of that industry should not be discussed in 'Open Forums' for end-users to view.​

If this thread was to move in the direction the OP had intended..... just about every media and it's raw prices would eventually be discussed and just another way of OUR, collectively all of us here, customers ability to get still another valuable piece of information to beat over our brow when pricing. On another note, do you realize that by spouting off what we all pay, he doesn't have to do further homework, because he now knows what his competition is selling for without having to go to all of their sites. He might've come in cheaper or maybe he would've been a pig and overcharged, but in our eagerness to just throw pertinent information out there.... you do all of his work for him. Pretty clever guy.

I can't tell you how many people have asked me..... are you the Gino on s101 ?? AND not many of them competitors or vendors..... but actual customers. So, we DO have a lot of people watching this forum as is suggested by all of the reports posted from time to time.

I was at the Mid-Atlantic Air Show a few weeks back and was introduced to a couple and when they found out I was a sign guy, the guy asked me if I ever heard of s101. I said yes. He then proceeded to tell me of a guy from his home town named Gino on there. I said that's probably me and I asked him if he was on. He said no, it's too dangerous on there, but I view it constantly.

This place gets a lot of hits and unless this kinda stuff is put in the..... at least safer categories.... this stuff should cease to take place out in the open.

My only question to this now 'Guest' was as stated directly to him. Publicly discussing and putting in writing these prices are not a good idea for many. It can hurt them and then I proceeded to ask him why if he was a distributor of this stuff he didn't already know this. Simple question only needs a simple answer. Not some defensive back-pedaling of all the things he's done wrong.... knowingly or not and then some side-stepping as to what has to do with this site or not...... not to mention the toe-dancing around being misunderstood and turning the blame on us.

For cripe's sake, some of us are here 20, 30, 40 and more years and we have some basic instinct of what to do and what not to do in business. If he can muster up a retort like this one, then he knew exactly what he was doing and was merely trolling. As I originally invited him to do was join as a Merchant Member, he took the low road and quit altogether and we're to feel the blame ??

Heck, even Addie's learned not to discuss these sort of things here anymore.​

 

[Fred Weiss]

Well Gino, you certainly have the right to say what you want. But you should, perhaps, give some thought to what you say, how you say it, whether a PM to me might have been a better choice, what the effect is on others, and what it might cost Signs 101.

I had researched him extensively before approving his registration. He was referred here by a major supplier to the trade (as are many of our newer members). He had nothing malevolent in mind and was simply in the role of advance scout for his company who is about to launch a new division involved in sign supply.

As such he was not familiar with the concerns of some over discussion of prices even though price is a major factor in the decision making of many members ... far more than those who don't want to see it discussed. He was trying to determine the value of an established brand over less costly alternatives.

The net result of your post and some of those that chimed in after you was to run off a new member who was ready, willing and able to refer lots of other new members here as well as spend a significant amount of advertising dollars here. And, BTW, this isn't the first time you've done this. Just the first time I've said something about it. Your actions in this thread were unwarranted and unwelcome. You didn't save the sign industry from harm. You simply caused an upcoming industry player to conclude that Signs 101 is not any place he wants to be. And you did so without even a note to me before jumping to your own conclusions.

As far as I can see, you and others are placing yourselves in the role of troll police and are abusing the position to the detriment of our community. You could have handled what was a troubling matter a lot differently and a lot better.

 

[Gino]

With all due respect, I’m not going to get into this with you. You know my views on this and have known them for many years. You’ve mostly disagreed with my views on people/members or newbies voicing valuable information like this in the open.

You’re correct, I don’t have the initial insight you have and don’t have the ability to call you on each and every one of these. So, his background and availability to be here or not is entirely on you. I never said or indicated he had malevolent intentions, but his actions were. He just had to define himself a little further. With his coming forth and leveling with all of us, we could’ve pointed him in the right direction and showed him how to become a worthwhile member or merchant.

I have responded in the only real fashion I have at my disposal….. posting what I think. I’m not responsible for anyone behind me or even in front of me voicing the same thing or to the opposing views. I’m stating my views and mine alone.

I had invited your guest to become a Merchant Member and he runs and away. How cool is that ??

:Oops: Oh yeah, and let’s not forget, almost 200 hits and only 6 votes. Like anyone wants to give up anything ??

My shoulders are very large, so you can use me for your poster boy in this ‘Witch Hunt’ but the fact remains…. he’s the individual coming in here and requested valuable information discussed on a public forum. I just tried to curb it to somewhere else within these walls.

If you think I run him off and he told you so…. it’s only because he feels he was found out. No company in the world is going to pass up an opportunity to make money because one of their employees screwed up or was embarrassed.

I am not looking or seeking the job position of ‘Troll Police’. That’s your job and I don’t want it. As to doing it better, I’ll have to figure out how to do it so as not to insult you or jeopardize your membership in any way, shape or form.

I’m all for a fair and knowledgeable site with more traffic than you can handle and overwhelming with Merchant Members contributing, but I don’t think for those having troubles in today’s economy and needing help, we need to make it harder in their vicinity by openly discussing valuable information that could very well hurt them.

As hard as it is for you to know what’s gonna come out of my mouth and possibly ruin a sale for you…. that’s how I see it with posters like this one. I can stop. Will they ??

 

[HulkSmash]

With all due respect, I’m not going to get into this with you. You know my views on this and have known them for many years. You’ve mostly disagreed with my views on people/members or newbies voicing valuable information like this in the open.

You’re correct, I don’t have the initial insight you have and don’t have the ability to call you on each and every one of these. So, his background and availability to be here or not is entirely on you. I never said or indicated he had malevolent intentions, but his actions were. He just had to define himself a little further. With his coming forth and leveling with all of us, we could’ve pointed him in the right direction and showed him how to become a worthwhile member or merchant.

I have responded in the only real fashion I have at my disposal….. posting what I think. I’m not responsible for anyone behind me or even in front of me voicing the same thing or to the opposing views. I’m stating my views and mine alone.

I had invited your guest to become a Merchant Member and he runs and away. How cool is that ??

:Oops: Oh yeah, and let’s not forget, almost 200 hits and only 6 votes. Like anyone wants to give up anything ??

My shoulders are very large, so you can use me for your poster boy in this ‘Witch Hunt’ but the fact remains…. he’s the individual coming in here and requested valuable information discussed on a public forum. I just tried to curb it to somewhere else within these walls.

If you think I run him off and he told you so…. it’s only because he feels he was found out. No company in the world is going to pass up an opportunity to make money because one of their employees screwed up or was embarrassed.

I am not looking or seeking the job position of ‘Troll Police’. That’s your job and I don’t want it. As to doing it better, I’ll have to figure out how to do it so as not to insult you or jeopardize your membership in any way, shape or form.

I’m all for a fair and knowledgeable site with more traffic than you can handle and overwhelming with Merchant Members contributing, but I don’t think for those having troubles in today’s economy and needing help, we need to make it harder in their vicinity by openly discussing valuable information that could very well hurt them.

As hard as it is for you to know what’s gonna come out of my mouth and possibly ruin a sale for you…. that’s how I see it with posters like this one. I can stop. Will they ??

Gino, usually i'm in agreement with you.

But this time, but the op's questions was less than harmless. I didn't see it
affecting anything in a negative way....In reality, you can google any brand of vinyl, and you'll find a site with a price listed.

 

[Gino]

Color, I learn and understand some thing better by reading what others post up and see into their perspective, but I write what I believe and that's all this is about. So, with what you posted..... correct, but couldn't the OP have done exactly what you said ??

I was going by his profile.... when it was still listed so all could read it. I only suggested he become a Merchant Member or come clean as to what his intentions were. Afterwards, it was blown out of proportion by others, so I naturally chimed in. Because I asked what his fishing was about or state the real reasons.... that's what would make an individual turn away ?? I hardly think so.

I never indicated any wrong doings, just tell us what you really want to know so we can help you.

I was very careful with this one, simply because his profile looked better than what the individual was acting. Later, he admitted not knowing and copped an attitude. Is that my fault ??

 

[HulkSmash]

Color, I learn and understand some thing better by reading what others post up and see into their perspective, but I write what I believe and that's all this is about. So, with what you posted..... correct, but couldn't the OP have done exactly what you said ??

I was going by his profile.... when it was still listed so all could read it. I only suggested he become a Merchant Member or come clean as to what his intentions were. Afterwards, it was blown out of proportion by others, so I naturally chimed in. Because I asked what his fishing was about or state the real reasons.... that's what would make an individual turn away ?? I hardly think so.

I never indicated any wrong doings, just tell us what you really want to know so we can help you.

I was very careful with this one, simply because his profile looked better than what the individual was acting. Later, he admitted not knowing and copped an attitude. Is that my fault ??

no, no, no.

not saying anything is your fault. Yeah, i guess the OP should have posted more info in his first post, stating what he was about, and after.. but if you think about it, being new, one wouldn't know exactly what everyone else is expecting. He came into this thinking, "ok need research, quick question" - nothing more.

I do get where you're coming from.