Sign Designing - Quote of the day...

[neato]

“A physician has the responsibility to heal and a sign designer has the responsibility to guide. Usually, physicians have no interference by others, contrary to the dilemma faced by sign designers, who most often seem to have an uninvited committee hovering over them. That notwithstanding, sign designers must stand their ground, short of alienating their client and losing the project. Making a sign more readable, functional and appealing is their craft, and it’s up to them to show that less-is-more. Always."

Stephen Salzberg - Signcraft Nov/Dec 2018

 

[Big Rice Field]

But it is also the designer's obligation to explain the concept of less is more by showing the customer a letter size visibility chart and also the nature of human ttention spans at both streeet and highway speeds.

 

[bannertime]

In an age where everyone can become an "expert" overnight by watching Youtube and reading mommy blogs, this is too true. I honestly find the worst offenders to be the ones that say "you're the expert so what do you recommend" because they normally go a different direction. They just wanted confirmation of their terrible ideas they got from the internet. It's becoming more and more popular to not trust your doctors because someone read something about a doctor misdiagnosing something that could have been 100 other things. Instead of doing what the doctor spent years studying about, let's sniff some oils that my neighbor is selling. I feel like some customers must be sniffing too much with the ridiculous thoughts they have on laying out even a simple bandit sign. "Yeah, no, let's make it that light gray with yellow and white background. Can you make the letters a little thinner? White space, white space, white space!"

 

[Gino]

I don't know about that........ ?? I've always felt like a doctor, because we're always preventing people from having heart attacks from.... I need it by the end of today !! I forgot to order these !! Is this even possible ??

 

[Rick]

I question my physician all the time, for all I know, he had a "D" average in school and barely passed.

Stephen Salzberg was an architectural sign designer so his clientele was different than most here. I have no clue if he still designs, but he's been around since the 60's

When you get into an architectural project - like an apartment, shopping center, hospital, airport or corporate/industrial complex you are usually dealing with other creatives like architects, interior designers, branding companies and in-house marketing/design people. You have to go in knowing how to answer these other creatives by explaining the process you used in getting to the solution you came up with. You also have to know all the codes relating to ADA, Fire and Safety as well and the municipal code. The "less is more" b/s is interpretive. If I went by that mantra every time... everything would be a squares and rectangles with letters stuck to it. What he's most likely alluding too is elements that do not relate to the surrounding architecture and how sign designers might try to avoid "decorating" walls, buildings and properties with signs. I do peer review for quite a few "sign designers" and in-house marketing staff, sadly quite a few miss the mark on code related signs or signs that are nearly impossible to replicate.

I read another quote by him about Florida and the race to the cheapest...
https://www.signsofthetimes.com/article/signmaker-stephen-salzberg-shares-his-thoughts-sign-design

If someone really wanted to know about this, they would need more than charts... it might help to know the process. A good read from an ancient but still informative book called Architectural Signing and Graphics by John Follis and Dave Hammer, or the newer
Signage and Wayfinding Design: A Complete Guide to Creating Environmental Graphic Design Systems
by Chris Calori and David Vanden-Eynden

 

[WildWestDesigns]

I question my physician all the time, for all I know, he had a "D" average in school and barely passed.

Boy, times must have changed. It was just "A", "B" and "C" were passing grades when I went to school.

Although, ironically, the grades that one makes in school aren't always an indicator on how good or bad that they are in a profession. Sometimes grades are more about the game that you play versus actual knowledge.

I do agree with the internet assessment in contributing a lot to this. So much information and a lot of people don't have the knowledge base to vet what they are reading/watching.

 

[Johnny Best]

My doctor is Vinnie Boombatz! Never seen a diploma of any kind on his wall.

 

[Gino]

Boy, times must have changed. It was just "A", "B" and "C" were passing grades when I went to school.

Although, ironically, the grades that one makes in school aren't always an indicator on how good or bad that they are in a profession. Sometimes grades are more about the game that you play versus actual knowledge.

I do agree with the internet assessment in contributing a lot to this. So much information and a lot of people don't have the knowledge base to vet what they are reading/watching.

Even if a lawyer, doctor or some other profession where lives depend on ya...... were to pass with a 'C' average... ya normally don't see those people practicing very well. They seem to be the lawyers, that look for loopholes, technical bullsh!t and ways to beat the system. Doctors... the same way. They don't tend to be real doctors, but more or less, just into things a normal doctor wouldn't venture into. None of them have the smarts to make it on their own and lean on crutches, so to speak to get through with things.... if they even stay in their field.

 

[bob]

Anyone who styles themselves a 'sign designer' is somewhere on a scale between presumptuous and a pompous a$$. Probably one who scored 'D's in school.

I sometimes use the same doctor as Mssr. Best and sometimes his colleague, Tommy the Tuba.

 

[neato]

Anyone who styles themselves a 'sign designer' is somewhere on a scale between presumptuous and a pompous a$$. Probably one who scored 'D's in school.

Darn, now I don't know what to tell people when they ask what I do for a living.

That might possibly be the dumbest thing I've seen posted on this forum...

oh, wait....nah.

 

[Johnny Best]

So Neato, since you are installing signs now. Tell people you are into erections.
Then you won’t be a pompous a$$ that you use to be.

 

[neato]

I always wondered why people didn't like me. So glad to have Signs101!

 

[Gino]

Now............. can someone tell me, why does this little guy reminds me of a swastika ?? All I see is Hitler when I see it.

 

[Johnny Best]

Now............. can someone tell me, why does this little guy reminds me of a swastika ?? All I see is Hitler when I see it.

Yep, it is what you thought it was Gino!

 

[coastguy111]

For someone who has to see the doctor on the regular, things are not the same as they used to be 10+years ago. Anyone notice how most of the small general practitioners offices have been closed down and now most doctors work in a large conglomerate setting. And your health care isn't between you and your doctor anymore. The CDC, DEA, and insurance companies dictate what doctors have to do.
Plus all your health records are now in a national virtual online network that any doctor, pharmacist, DEA, CDC, and all the way down to police officers can access without your consent. But you say that's illegal because of the HIPPA laws...? Used to be that way but after Obamacare passed and all the loopholes that were hidden throughout the 1000 pages and were rolled out over the 8 year period.
Your doctor and you are not capable of making any of your healthcare decisions anymore. The best thing you can do is be as healthy as you can and not get hurt to the point of needing on going care.

 

[Big Rice Field]

Anyone who styles themselves a 'sign designer' is somewhere on a scale between presumptuous and a pompous a$$. Probably one who scored 'D's in school.

I sometimes use the same doctor as Mssr. Best and sometimes his colleague, Tommy the Tuba.

Except for the ones who acrtully went to design school and/or engineering drawing school.

 

[bob]

Except for the ones who acrtully went to design school and/or engineering drawing school.

The point, which appears to scamper right past you, is that signs are not designed. It's rather a different, perhaps even similar but still different, process. It's not something that you pick up at 'design school' or 'engineering drawing school', whatever that might be. I've spent more that the last half-century both designing stuff and making signs for even a bit longer than that. Not once, not ever did I design a sign.

 

[Gino]

Hafta agree with Bob on this..... 100%

While signs have a thought process being used and you pull from elements of good layout, if doesn't necessarily fall into a design state. When an artist makes a painting, it's a composition using techniques from his/her repritoire and a nice painting follows, but it wasn't designed. Same with a songwriter or composer, they draw from knowledge of what goes well together. Hopefully it will sound good, otherwise, it'll never make the charts, but rarely do we say, that was a lousy designed song.

Perhaps, using the word design is what's so confusing to many. However, designs are plans like building a house or a bridge. These things are designed, because they are a unique application of a lotta the other thought patterns, but it's for this one use only. Designs can be copied, but while you're still using things like balance, color combinations and weight throughout, you are still making a one-of-a-kind. So, even though a sign may be a one of a kind, there could be a thousand more, just like it, just utilizing a different name. Good signs are not very common any more, but they still exist and whats even more rare are good logos or designs. Sometimes it's just hard to re-re-invent the wheel.

 

[kcollinsdesign]

I guess I'll hafta start calling myself a "Sign Artist". Don't want to be pretentious (what the poster probably meant) or pompous!

 

[Johnny Best]

Design, strange word. Usually when you put "de" in front of a word it means to remove or reduction. Like in Photoshop they have a dehaze tool. Or, the word destroy or debunk. So adding de in front of sign would leave you with nothing on the sign. Now if I spent hours designing a sign and ended up with nothing, now that would make me depressed.