David Wright
New Member
Did you ever read your tagline?
-
I want to thank all the members that have upgraded your accounts. I truly appreciate your support of the site monetarily. Supporting the site keeps this site up and running as a lot of work daily goes on behind the scenes. Click to Support Signs101 ...
Websites on iPad
- Thread starter SqueeGee
- Start date
Did you ever read your tagline?
Dan Antonelli
New Member
We stopped using Flash about a year and a half ago, and 95% of the time we're substituting where we used to use it with Jquery. However, some clients still insist on it - so in those instances, we use browser detectors and just send them to the non-flash version if on Apple mobile devices. If not they can go to the flash one. This way we're covered in both instances.
It still has it's place be we advocate against it. In my own opinion, I think it will always hold a place online, but doubt it will be mainstream like it was 3-5 years ago. Like Joe said, HTML5 shows promise but is still limited (as was Flash 1.0).
It still has it's place be we advocate against it. In my own opinion, I think it will always hold a place online, but doubt it will be mainstream like it was 3-5 years ago. Like Joe said, HTML5 shows promise but is still limited (as was Flash 1.0).
WildWestDesigns
Active Member
Statistically speaking on all of the mac threads that he posts in (that I can remember), I think his parachute gets jammed.
WildWestDesigns
Active Member
I agree with that. It seemed like everyone and their dog had some flash based website a few yrs ago.
FrankenSigns.biz
New Member
So I'm the one who is accepting of a new technology and you insinuate I'm not open minded? You, sir, should read my tagline.
WildWestDesigns
Active Member
I don't think that is what he was getting at. It's much less accepting new technology as everything that apple does is damn near perfection (or maybe in your mind it is perfection, I dunno) and you either get onboard or get left behind. It's either one or the other, hence no open mind to other possibilities.
CES020
New Member
I find it funny that the CEO of one of the, if not the, largest tech company in the world makes statements about why he runs his business they way he decides to and then sign makers on a forum tell him how stupid he is day after day.
I also think it's funny that people pretend Flash works great on other mobile devices. There are 1000's and 1000's of pages on the 'net' where people are frustrated with how crappy flash is, and how it's hit or miss. Works great some times, other times it sucks. Search it on youtube, there are videos that show it. Jobs just made the decision he didn't want his products running into that problem. So far, it seems to have worked out for him. They break records on sales about every quarter. He must know something sign makers don't.
Yet, when it's posts and videos like that, they will be dismissed and trivial but the same number of posts or clips about any apple product and it's "an outrage".
I also think it's funny that people pretend Flash works great on other mobile devices. There are 1000's and 1000's of pages on the 'net' where people are frustrated with how crappy flash is, and how it's hit or miss. Works great some times, other times it sucks. Search it on youtube, there are videos that show it. Jobs just made the decision he didn't want his products running into that problem. So far, it seems to have worked out for him. They break records on sales about every quarter. He must know something sign makers don't.
Yet, when it's posts and videos like that, they will be dismissed and trivial but the same number of posts or clips about any apple product and it's "an outrage".
WildWestDesigns
Active Member
This kind of thing happens no matter what you are talking about. It will continue to happen this way because human nature doesn't change as easily as we would like to hope that it does.
Personally, it's not Jobs that I have the beef with as much as the fans, but that happens on either case and I can be the same way myself at times.
It's what keeps life so interesting. I personally like debates like this because it gets people to think and defend their positions and maybe even change their position depending on how the debate goes.
Everyone is breaking records, MS and Google both just posted all time profit quarters. Their devices support Flash
. Just being a devil's advocate...I see Jobs' point, I also think he's an insane control freak and his products are too restricted for me but very well targeted for the masses.
However, he's right that Flash shouldn't be used in web design anymore and sites that haven't been converted should have been converted years ago. There's really no point as you can do most of what Flash is used for in jquery/javascript/ajax anyway. Flash still has use for banners and ads but not much else, at least as the final display format.
Joe Diaz
New Member
This is where I disagree with you. Years ago there was no alternative to flash that is capable of doing all the things flash can do... there still isn't. html5 is not where it needs to be to replace flash.
I've heard people say this before, but I think they seriously underestimate the capabilities of flash. Their comments also don't take into consideration the GUI developer tools (flash professional), which is presently unmatched by anything out there. It would be exactly like saying .eps files are better than .ai files so people should stop using Adobe Illustrator.
Again. a total lack of understanding on every thing flash can do.
Don't get me wrong. Flash is not necessary for a good majority of the internet. I'm not saying that it is. I also understand that developers have been left with little choice but stop using flash IF they want their work to display correctly on the 3 to 5% of devices without the flash playback. But What I have been trying to convey are these three things:
1. The alternative to flash has yet to prove to be a superior replacement.
2. It is going to take several years for flash to die out if it will at all.
3. The fact that you can't view all of the internet including flash on the ipad is not the developers fault, it's apples fault for not figuring out a way to do it right.
David Wright
New Member
No, to a mind numbing point you can see no other and have total allegiance to one brand. Defending it as if it was the be all and end all in tech.
And as far as new technology, you should qualify that. Only technology from one company. Most of which they didn't invent.
I think it's important to point out to everyone championing html5 as the be all end all solution that besides not being able to do everything flash can do at the moment, it also isn't 100% supported by every browser our customers are using. IE9 made a huge step in browser support for html5 and css3, but it is still behind firefox and the webkit browsers. This isn't even taking into account all the IE users that are still using older versions. Only in the last year or so has it become viable to stop developing sites to work in IE6, which came out 10 years ago, are we comfortable waiting another 10 years for the world to get up to date with full html5 support? Luckily, Firefox and Chrome both have larger market shares than IE9 now, but we can't ignore the fact that there are thousands of customers not using iPads that won't be able to properly view an html5 site.
For the record, I haven't used flash much at all for quite some time, but my decision to drop it was due to SEO reasons and not being as comfortable with the development environment, not because Steve Jobs told me it sucked.
Edit* Also, I wanted to point out that I do believe html5 is the way to go, both now and in the future, I just think it's important to realize that there are end users out there that won't get the full experience from an html5 website. That's something that we can't ignore at the moment.
Last edited:
Joe Diaz
New Member
I agree with you adrock. We don't use it as much any more because we prefer to use Wordpress now to build sites. You can use flash with Wordpress, but the whole point for us using wordpress is so that our customers could easily access the content of their site. It is possible for the customer to access the content within the flash portions of their site without needing flash pro to do so, however if it's custom flash work it take significantly more coding to do so, and they tend to not what to pay for that. So we have scaled back on flash.
I have always explained the pros and cons flash to my customers. Like Dan when we do use flash, we like to have replacement content that appears when flash isn't detected.
But you bring up good points. If you have ever built websites like you and I have, you know what a pain it can be to get everything working the same way on all browsers. For example, Sometimes we have to make additional css styles just for ie. The great thing about the flash plugin is, that as long as you follow the web standards for embedding it, you didn't have to worry about it displaying differently on different browsers that support flash. The very nature of html5 leads me to believe that this could be an issue. And when you are creating things as complex as what you can in flash, and you have to worry about browser compatibility, You have to wonder if html5 is a good replacement.
Then on top of that anyone that visits a site with html5 can see the code used to make it. I like the idea of protecting my intellectual property from everyone that views my work like I can with flash. I'm not knocking html5, but I'm wondering why both can't exist in the same market, especially since both have their own strengths and weaknesses.