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What the #$&**** is going on with Cloud?!?!?!

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IsItFasst

New Member
I am going nuts!!!! It seems everyday I am throwing profits out the door in wasted material while spending hours trying to figure out how to get things to work right. Never had issues for the last 10+ years until using Cloud. I had major issues on one computer/machine after upgrading to Cloud that I finally (kinda sorta) got straightened out last week. But now on my other computer it has become a nightmare. This computer/printer has been working fine with Cloud for the last 6 months and now after what appears to be an update with Flexi all hell has broken loose.

Now after I laminate, the machine (Roland SP-300V) finds the crop marks and starts to cut but it is off by about half an inch on all cuts down the length of the roll. The first row of cuts isn't even complete because those cuts would be in front of the crop marks. Left to right cutting is right on. I've tried restarting production manager, restarting the software, restarting the computer, tried different files all with the exact same results. It still prints/cuts fine if I send the job at as one. This all started after what appears to be a software update since my production manager looks different now.

Everyone else just having a blast with the Cloud version?

Update/More info since I've been playing around with things for several more hours with still no solution:

For this set up I am running a Roland SP-300V with 11sp6 Build 2145 on Windows 8.1.

  • When I print, laminate and put the material back in the machine the crop marks are found properly. But when it goes to cut, the cuts are precisely 0.5 inch off down the roll. It wants to cut a half an inch towards the front of the sheet. I've tried different files, resetting the computer, etc. with the same results. Machine cuts just fine if I send as one job so this only has to do with production manager/crop marks.
  • Since I have to wait 24 hours for the ink to dry so I can laminate/re-cut I decided to do some test prints using crop marks and then instantly try to do the cut. This is where it even gets more weird. At first I did two small blocks a few inches apart but on the same plane. When it cuts it wouldn't cut the line closest to the front of the sheet. It would just cut a U shape instead of the entire square. When zooming in within PM it appears that that front side cut is missing for some reason even though it shows just fine in the design software.
  • So I decided to do a different test cut with the boxes off-set having one down the roll a few inches. Not surprisingly the front line didn't get cut as in tests beforehand. But what is even more odd is that the square that was further down the sheet actually cut sides next to the square but the cut was elongated by about 0.25 inches. It essentially made a 1.00 square into a 1.0x1.25 inch cut. So it isn't anywhere close to the printed square on the end closest to the front of the sheet.
 
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D

Drip Dry

New Member
I wouldn't be so quick to blame Flexi. My Roland is notorious for not cutting correctly.

If you think it's Flexi, do you have Versaworks that you can try. Or maybe you can give the file to someone who could put a contour cut on it and send it back to you as a EPS file. In other words, take Flexi out of the loop.
 
I

IsItFasst

New Member
I appreciate the input.

I suppose it could be the machine but seems quite odd it started doing this after the last update. Normally if it is the machine not reading crop marks correctly I will get an error. I noticed that on the last update of Flexi some default changes were made in production manager that were never there before (example: its default send mode before would "send now" but after the update it changed to "hold in list"). It's also odd that "position" is 0.5" for cutting but was 1.0" when printing....which my cuts on those jobs were precisely half an inch off at the beginning of the sheet. May be a coincidence it sure seems likely that has something to do with it. Though with further testing there are all kinds of things going wrong now (see edit at bottom of original post). But as stated in the original post the print/cut jobs sent as one work fine.

Unfortunately I have always cut with Flexi so I don't have an easy way to test something else. On my other computer I am having issues with, I was told to to do something similar to make sure it wasn't a problem with the cutter. I did that showing the machine worked fine with Cut Studio (or whatever Roland sends out with their cutters) and Flexi support still says it must be the machine. So not sure I really want to go to all that trouble (install software, learn how it works, etc.) again to prove it isn't the machine just to be told it is the machine...
 
mrugen

mrugen

New Member
Step by Ste Info p is Needed to Solve Issues

Finding out the actual cause is a step by step process. Do what you can on your end first. Create a simple project and see if you can duplicate the issue again. Ask youself a few questions:


  1. When did this issue begin?
  2. Did I update anything BESIDES Flexi?
  3. Do some projects work but not others?
  4. Can I repeat this issue with other projects, examples?
  5. What changed from the time it worked and the time it did not?

Next, write each step down carefully, describing how you designed the project, what commands you used to set up the output, etc. Gather this info and you'll be well on the way to solving the issue.

Also, keep in mind that trackiing down issues when you have jobs to do is very frustrating. I can assure you all of us recognize it and want to help, so give us some info to work from. Since there are several pieces in this puzzle; the file, the software, the operating system, the hardware, the printer etc. we just need to eliminate them one at a time until we find the right answer.

I know it's tough to hear, but keep at it and then let us all know the answers you find. We are here to help.
 
Steph_Stamm

Steph_Stamm

New Member
While they do get to emails as quickly as possible, phone calls take priority. Usually the support team is less busy in the afternoons, so you may hear back shortly, or you might want to try calling in.
 
I

IsItFasst

New Member
mrugen said:
Finding out the actual cause is a step by step process. Do what you can on your end first. Create a simple project and see if you can duplicate the issue again. Ask youself a few questions:


  1. When did this issue begin?
  2. Did I update anything BESIDES Flexi?
  3. Do some projects work but not others?
  4. Can I repeat this issue with other projects, examples?
  5. What changed from the time it worked and the time it did not?

Next, write each step down carefully, describing how you designed the project, what commands you used to set up the output, etc. Gather this info and you'll be well on the way to solving the issue.

Also, keep in mind that trackiing down issues when you have jobs to do is very frustrating. I can assure you all of us recognize it and want to help, so give us some info to work from. Since there are several pieces in this puzzle; the file, the software, the operating system, the hardware, the printer etc. we just need to eliminate them one at a time until we find the right answer.

I know it's tough to hear, but keep at it and then let us all know the answers you find. We are here to help.
Click to expand...

Believe me I have been trying over and over to get the problem fixed. Spent about 12 hours on Sunday printing/testing everything I could think of to try and get this to work since I have orders that needed to go out. But I'll answer the questions you asked which will probably explain why I'm so frustrated.


  1. When did this issue begin? As far as I can tell it would be Saturday as that was the first job that didn't cut properly using crop marks.
  2. Did I update anything BESIDES Flexi? Not that I am aware of. But with auto-updates occurring these days who knows. I don't ever manually update Flexi...it just happens where one day my production manager looked different and settings were changed.
  3. Do some projects work but not others? I have tried several different files and even just drawn up simple boxes for testing all with the same results. The very first job in my PM queue from Saturday did cut properly yesterday. Which is odd because the next job was printed about 40 minutes later and ALL jobs after that one are giving me issues.
  4. Can I repeat this issue with other projects, examples? Yes. The exact same problem occurs with every job now. I can't get any to work properly. It seems that after the crop marks are read it thinks the cut area need to be slightly larger within the feed setting (down the roll). The longer the job the worse it is. It is always WAY off at the front of the sheet/machine with cuts at the end of the sheet being where they should be.
  5. What changed from the time it worked and the time it did not? I am not sure what changed exactly since Clouds seems to crash almost daily. So it may have crashed between job 1 and job 2. Then it may have updated on the restart. It's all hard to say because it wasn't like I instantly noticed the issue due to the fact that I was waiting for the ink to dry for 24 hours before I laminated. So it was a day later before I noticed the problem....can't really remember what happened but I know I didn't manually update anything or download any new software on Saturday.

I do appreciate you taking the time for your input. The main reason I feel that it is a Flexi issue is because in simple testing the front side cut line is always cut off even in a preview pane in PM for the cut lines. This may just be because of the low resolution of the cut line preview though. Really just wish I knew it was either the machine or the software so I could focus on one.
 
I

IsItFasst

New Member
Just to make sure it wasn't a fluke or a problem with the machine, I went ahead and reprinted the job #1 in my PM queue (since I have in hold mode). Machine found the crop marks and cut properly as it did before. So it seems something happened to a setting in that 40 minutes between job #1 and job #2. I have looked at all the settings for printing and cutting in PM for every job after and can't find a difference.

FYI. I like to find the solution online first if possible. If I can't find a solution, I like to start a thread so I can post the solution once found. That way if others have the same problem it can help....or if the problem occurs again for me I can easily find the solution (if it's been so long I forget what the fix was).
 
mrugen

mrugen

New Member
Start a New Print Setup

So, if it were me, I'd begin by installing a NEW printer setup.

Go to Production Manager.
Click the SETUP menu and choose ADD SETUP
Choose HYBRID DEVICES
Find Roland and Your printer model
Be sure to type the correct TCP/IP address
Click NEXT

Okay now you should have a new print queue with all the default settings. Send the job to the NEW queue and see if it fixes everything.
 
I

IsItFasst

New Member
Thanks for all the input. While I still haven't found what the fix is, I (think) have found out what is causing the problem. This one file I am trying to print/laminate/cut is the main problem. Once I try to print/lam/cut that file ALL other files after that become "corrupt" with the same problem. It is like the PM keeps remembering a setting from that file so every file I open after that gets "corrupted" with that setting and responds the same. Even if I clear the file from the queue, it will keep doing it. I can even close the program completely, restart and when I try to print/lam/cut it will have those corrupt settings. The only way I can get them to clear so things work normal is restart the program/print and cut a file (no crop marks)/then go to a cropmark print. This is why all files I try to print/lam/cut after opening the one are causing the same issue.

I figured that maybe I could "repair" the settings of this one file by creating a new file and simply copying the vector from that file into the new file but somehow it seems that this corrupt setting even seems to follows when copying the vectors over. This is extremely odd behavior that I have no idea how to fix/print the one file I can't seem to get to work. At least I can get other files to work now (so far). I suppose I will try to export the files as .eps and see if that clears the settings so I can get this job done.

Anyone ever seen anything like this? Or know how PM saves the setting default from one job to the next?
 
mrugen

mrugen

New Member
Interesting Find

That makes some sense. Regardless of the file, if you send any file to Production manager and change a settings, the next file sent will use the previous settings. You need to check options each time you send files. As an example, suppose you send a cut file. Now in PM you change the size from 100% to 150%. Works fine. Next job you send, the Cut menu will be set to a sixze of 150% unless you change it back. This is NOT an error or bug, it's simply the way Flexi works. With this understanding, it may be that the file you are trying to send is "somehow" changing the rip & print menu and those are becoming the defaults afterward for other files. Just what it is chaging and how it is doing so is rather a mystery. Typically, chages are only made by the operator not the file.

This is a good one to send ot the SAI techs to dwell over. Send them the file and all your notes.
 
I

IsItFasst

New Member
Glad to say I have finally "fixed" the problem. Whatever was stored in the one file that was giving me issues was the entire problem the whole time. So it doesn't appear to be an update issue after all. I know if you save a job after you print/lam/cut it will save those settings in the file for the PM too. Not sure what is or even could be wrong in that file to make it act all goofy but I'm going to send it over to Flexi support to see if they can figure it out. Would like to know what the cause of this 4 day ordeal was so if it happens again I'll know what setting was off. I'll report back if they find the issue.

And not that it caused the problem (or that I want to) but is there a way to turn off updates with Cloud? I didn't see a way to disable it anywhere.
 
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