Competition for the Versacamm

[SAS]

I also look at the DC-4 at the show the guy said it will accept media from 24 to 54 inches. Cost per sq. ft. was around $2.20 I went to the show to look at all the printers, well just two the DC-4 and the Roland Versacamm 54" same price but with the cost of running the Roland about a dollar cheaper I think I'm going to go with it. But I have not acted on it this week because I still don't know if I want it. That's a big investment not look at all options. Any one have any input on the DC-4 or Versacamm that has not been said?

 

[ChiknNutz]

I just read that they have some "new print modes" that will allow it to print on specialty materials such as banner material. If I didn't already have my SP540, I'd be a lot more interested in this unit.

 

[2NinerNiner2]

SAS - I beieve that Fred has mentioned something along this line in his previous posts in this thread and I'll reiterate: where is the dealer? Here in Montreal, I have 2 Roland dealers, on the same street, 3 blocks apart! Made my decision quite easy

 

[Fred Weiss]

There's a guy three miles away from me with a DC-3. He has it in a clean room with a filtered power source. About a year ago he started having some dropouts appearing in his prints. 3,600 miles away a voice suggested he wipe off his vinyl and he did and that didn't fix it. Then the voice said try a new roll of vinyl ... and he did and that didn't fix it. Then parts arrived one at a time by air freight and replacing them did not fix it. Finally after more than two weeks of down time he paid to have a technician flown in and it was finally fixed.

All told the repair cost him around $4,000 and almost three weeks of orders not produced ... a fair number of them lost forever. Summa had no dealer and no way to provide a loaner machine. The customer paid the price.

He got a great deal on the machine. Less than $19,000. He paid his savings back and then some with one major breakdown.

I can't speak to the DC-4 having any ability to run banners. The predecessors of this model did not have the ability to image onto materials that were not super smooth and very thin. Even imaging onto reflective was out of the question. If they claim to be able to image onto banners, I would have to conclude that it was specially made, not particularly strong and likely pricey.

But at somewhere north of $2.20 a square foot under ideal usage conditions, I would have to rule out using a DC-4 for making banners anyway. So there we are, back where we started. My current costs to image with my Edge using Oracal 751 and CMYK Duracoat foils is less than $1.70 a foot. I can run a lot more kinds of materials through the machine as well and repair costs are greatly reduced by having dealers within a reasonable distance and shippable loaners awaiting my need.

 

[Techman]

frog juice and they DO NOT recommend it for digital prints

I used frog juice on printed work. Was told it is great for it. However. It smeared my work. It melts the back side magnetic material if it runs back there. And, It flakes off.

So, take for what its worth. Frog juice is not suitable for printed work. And if you wish,, send me shipping and you can have a can of unopened frog juice.
I'd rather use floor wax..

 

[TresL]

I'm with Techman, I have never had great results with Frog Juice on anything printed.......

It is VERY harsh and takes a VERY long time to dry, even when used in very light coats....

 

[threeputt]

Doug, good point! Does anyone know of a finite way to know how much ventillation is needed? We work in an area with 14 foot ceilings (5000 foot shop). But is that adequate? Do you know firsthand of anyone getting sick or having some sort of symptoms?

I've been in this industry all my life and that includes screenprinting with no ventillation, painting with paints and solvents, etc. So I'm probably ruined already. But there is the employees to think about.

Charles

 

[ColorFast]

In Regards to Ventilation,
I am currently employed at a SMALL sign shop running a 54" Roland VersaCamm. Of course the salesman told my boss that ventilation was absolutley NOT required since it runs ECO-SOL max ink. Well, since then, we have had a number of days when employees would leave with headaches. On the worst day, our CSR lost her vision and 3 other employees had headaches/dizziness. Now, a number of factors could have caused this I suppose but these problems were non-existent before the new printer arrived (Oct.). The printer itself is great (except for $@#%# print-lam-cut jobs). Be advised, never listen to a salesman.

 

[Schultz Designs]

When You print, laminate and cut a job, do you have to adjust blade pressure to cut through both vinyl and overlaminate? Just curious...

 

[Steve C.]

When You print, laminate and cut a job, do you have to adjust blade pressure to cut through both vinyl and overlaminate? Just curious...

Yes.

 

[Schultz Designs]

Thanks. But what about blade stick out... I keep my blade quite short to the holder, just long enough to cut 3 mil material without dragging. This would definitely be not enough. How far out would you leave your blade tip?

 

[2NinerNiner2]

Kevin - I gave my SP-300 one full turn "out" and it seems to be cutting both laminate and vinyl just fine now

 

[WVB]

DC4 runs .40 cents pc (per color) psqf (per square foot). So a 3 color print will run you $1.29 sqf with out material. Summa has stated you can use other vinyl films such as Oracal/3M etc. through the DC4. You can also print directly to banner material. Although the banner material is only 12oz or 13oz material and you have to go through Summa for such. The banner material alone will run you $1 sqf. You can run CMYK or spot colors through the DC4 and each ribbon will supply you with 369 sqf total of printing before replacing ribbon. There is also a foil available to laminate the prints as well. With that being said I would take it you would still need to tape app the film for install? Or you can run the prints through a cold/hot laminator. Is the DC4 not identical to a Edge only larger? The DC4 will accept media in three sizes 24", 30" and 54" I am not sure why they have done this? If the machine is capable of 24" widths up to 54" widths why no 48" widths or any size inbetween for that matter such as scrap material left overs? Summa is sending me some info along with a file I sent them for printing to compare.

 

[wildside]

Does anyone know of a finite way to know how much ventillation is needed? We work in an area with 14 foot ceilings (5000 foot shop). But is that adequate? Do you know firsthand of anyone getting sick or having some sort of symptoms?

I used to work for a shop that had a mimaki jv3-160

it was housed in a room maybe 10ftX20ft, had the recommended ventilation system for the size of room and the machine. close the doors and run the machine no problem, nothing but a faint smell during long runs

then they switched to a seiko colorpainter, same room and was told the ventilation systems was more than accurate

well, anyone in the room for more than 30 minutes had a serious headache, one of the girls got sick....not hospital sick, but everyone knew what she had for lunch...i always got headaches with the sieko, but i think the ventilation system should match the room and the printer, be carefull of the air movement, the owner tried putting fans in to help, it did aleviate the headaches, but then there were dust particals in the prints..

 

[iSign]

spend the $5K for an air duster & be done with it. Whats a few brain cells worth anyway?

 

[printman716]

Just a NOTE! I purchased a mutho falcon outdoor with a graftec 64 cutter And a Lamanator. and let me tell you It was the best Investment I'v made.
It had some bugs in the begining but masterd the machine and can fix, maintain & control all aspects of the machine & profiles. I'v put a bulk Ink system on It with outher company inks (saves a shit load of MONEY!). I'v done shirts, mugs,hats, mouse pads, full color prints for lightboxes ,wraps,contour cut decals, Billboards, boats, 18 wheelers, full color magnets, even full color lawn signs for 45.00 each @ 50. you name IT I'v done It! I'v made more money in the last 15 months than i did in two years without It. So don't think about It anymore just do It!.........Phil @ printman716@aol.com

 

[printman716]

Just a NOTE! I purchased a mutho falcon outdoor with a graftec 64 cutter. And a Lamanator. and let me tell you It was the best Investment I'v made.
It had some bugs in the begining but masterd the machine and can fix, maintain & control all aspects of the machine & profiles. I put a bulk Ink system on It (saves alot of MONEY!). I'v done shirts, mugs, hats, mouse pads, full color prints for lightboxes ,wraps, contour cut decals, Billboards, boats, 18 wheelers, full color magnets, even full color lawn signs for 45.00 each @ 50. you name IT I'v done It! I'v made more money in the last 15 months than i did in two years without It. So don't think about It anymore just do It!.........Phil @ printman716@aol.com