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Neon Signs Masterclass

nolanola

New Member
Hello.
I'm interested in learning the basics of making neon signs.
Willing to travel for a masterclass.
Can you recommend an experienced neon sign maker who would be glad to share the knowledge for a reward?
I heard about Morgan in Chicago, but can't find his contact information.

Thank you.
 

visual800

Active Member
Im curious as to why you want to learn this trade at this point in time? Not being snarky just curious
 

Billct2

Active Member
There are some places that teach neon, but most of them are just introductory, meant to give an overview of the process and maybe you get to take home an art project. Really learning the craft is intensive and time consuming. I took a semester class in NYC and learned enough to know I didn't want to continue. It's really technical and I don't know how you could learn even the basics without spending a lot of time with a good teacher.
 

nolanola

New Member
Im curious as to why you want to learn this trade at this point in time? Not being snarky just curious
I think there is a good market for neon signs in New Orleans. Also, neon signs are great for an interior application.
I can get the equipment relatively cheap ($2000) that's why I want to know the total cost of having it on the list of services I provide (cost of the equipment + learning time).
 

nolanola

New Member
There are some places that teach neon, but most of them are just introductory, meant to give an overview of the process and maybe you get to take home an art project. Really learning the craft is intensive and time consuming. I took a semester class in NYC and learned enough to know I didn't want to continue. It's really technical and I don't know how you could learn even the basics without spending a lot of time with a good teacher.
How much time would it take to get to a level where I can make a basic sign? 100 hours?
 

Billct2

Active Member
From what I learned I figured it would be a multi year commitment to get to the basic level which is why I decided against it. Back then there was opportunity to actually produce glass that didn't have to be "perfect" because it was used to light channel letters. But now the only time neon is used in the sign business is for exposed tube which has to be perfect. I talked to oldtimers who learned back in the day of beer signs. Those were produced factory style, and your job might be bending one word or a few letters of a word over and over. You should take one of the introductory workshops and see for yourself, or find a local neon shop and see if they're willing to let you watch the process.
 

MikePro

New Member
scoff all you want, but neon isn't going away anytime soon. you might not be using it as the illumination source for most signage, but glass tubes are fragile and always in need of service. plus, if you're always thinking outside of the box, you can make some really awesome custom artwork.

besides, its a pain to turn-away clients looking for a "sign guy" and you can't fulfill all the services that they think you can.
 

Texas_Signmaker

Very Active Signmaker
scoff all you want, but neon isn't going away anytime soon. you might not be using it as the illumination source for most signage, but glass tubes are fragile and always in need of service. plus, if you're always thinking outside of the box, you can make some really awesome custom artwork.

besides, its a pain to turn-away clients looking for a "sign guy" and you can't fulfill all the services that they think you can.

Think they were pointing out a R.O.I. issue. I hate turning away stuff too but when considering offering a new service that required time & $$ it's good to know if it will be profitable and not a waste time.
 

JR's

New Member
You could do what I did a while back. I had two wholesalers that would offer me neon services.
One was a neon sign guy. He was Indian, Native American person that had a neon shop. And he would wholesale to the trade. And I also used Nepco sign supply. And they were wholesale to the trade only.
At first I would order a complete sign. Then I started to draw up the patterns. As I started learning I would order the neon at different stages of completion to save money and to learn. I think I still have some of the block out paint around.
 

nolanola

New Member
You could do what I did a while back. I had two wholesalers that would offer me neon services.
One was a neon sign guy. He was Indian, Native American person that had a neon shop. And he would wholesale to the trade. And I also used Nepco sign supply. And they were wholesale to the trade only.
At first I would order a complete sign. Then I started to draw up the patterns. As I started learning I would order the neon at different stages of completion to save money and to learn. I think I still have some of the block out paint around.
That's exactly how I feel.
To successfully outsource something you better know how it all works. I want to be able to estimate (labor and materials) neon sign projects.
I assume shipping assembled signs can be a problem.

Thank you!
 

astro8

New Member
It takes years of full time employment to become a proficient neon glass bender. Like Billct2 says...a bender used to start on the neon used for illuminated letters and such, rough stuff, until they become good enough to bend signs with bare glass. Those days are gone. These days everything has to be perfect. You can also add into the equation that the neon signs that customers expect these days seem to be getting smaller and more intricate than any done years ago.
My brother is a neon bender, started when he was 15, some thirty five years ago. There's no way I'd even try to attempt becoming a neon bender.

I know that's not what you want to hear but it's the facts.
 

Johnny Best

Active Member
I think it would be great to learn that trade. It's magical to walk into a room with a man making neon. With all the glass turning knobs to fill with gas, the heavy little bottle of mercury, asbestos patterns and gas flames making their sounds and boxes of glass tubing stacked high.
Good luck in your quest to learn, I bet I have watched someone bending neon over a 100 hours and I would never attempt to do it. Like learning how to be a Wizard.
 

Billct2

Active Member
"scoff all you want, but neon isn't going away anytime soon" Who was scoffing? We were talking about how much time & effort (and $) would it take to learn how to do it. I know a local neon guy and he has all the business he can handle.
 

MikePro

New Member
Bill. My comment was in response to the "why learn at this point in time" question. I think i intended to quote it, but whatevs.

edited to add: my comment should have been more along the lines of - "why would you NOT want to learn how?", and then followed up any reply with my first post/rant :)
 
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doublesigndude

New Member
I was fortunate enough to be in a position to learn how to bend neon tubing. My uncle owned a sign shop that employed an old boy that was ready to retire from bending. He came back from WWII and went to a glass/tube bending class in Chicago & made beautiful signs for many years. The way he would process the tubing was an art form & has slowly been turned back into a science, exact measures to ensure quality tubing. He even had a setup for coating his own tubes. He showed me the basics and I'd buy 50 pound boxes of clear glass, 12mm & 15mm, welding and bending, double backs, 90 degree bends, drops. Then came the day he showed me how to use the ribbon burner, for the long rounded bends. Lot's and lot's of practice. Hours a day. Not something that you're going to pick up 1st couple tries unfortunately. If you can pick up the equipment for a fair enough price & can find someone to show you the basics then that's the way to go. It's a slow process but very rewarding. To spend hours on a piece and the make 1 bad weld or bend can be rather frustrating. I have little or no patients but was able to work with the glass, almost a form of meditation. A lot like playing chess, thinking several moves in advanced, how you're going to connect 1 letter to the next, how it's all going to be wired up in the end.

I just sold my equipment a couple years ago. The old boy that taught me the trade had old antiquated equipment, back in '93-'94. I bought brand new, top of the line everything in 2002, final tab for the equipment was roughly $11k, had an pay for electrical & gas hookups, another $350-$400. Made it all back quick. Raw materials are very inexpensive, you pay for the labor definitely. Best of luck!!
 

Niun

Waffle Baron
I have a close friend who is a bender who's been in it for over 25 years and he seems to think its a dying art.. He closed his shop 5 years ago and went to work for someone who does repairs because most of the townships, cities, etc. won't permit these anymore. It's all LED and bendable alternatives sadly.

But back to your question, he says he apprenticed for about 5 years before he felt confident enough to actually work at it on his own.
 
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