New Gerber Edge FX Announced

[Fred Weiss]

This information is heresay and not official:

The Edge & Edge2 will both be discontinued in May of 2005

FX will have re-fillable cartridges & they will have a proprietary "tag" on the foils. All current foil colors will be made for FX & they will be available in various lengths (including longer lengths then current Gerber foils) Print costs will be lower (then existing GERBER print costs) based on the availability of refill rolls & longer lengths. The foils will be quicker & easier to change without even opening the cover, but instead by using a cartridge slot

FX will not be compatible with the current foils & nor will edges work w/FX foils, but all the same materials, foil colors, & fire files will be compatible with FX

FX will "read" the "tag" & know if it sees 3rd party foils... but the rumor that it wouldn't accept them is not true. The "tag" will sense the amount of foil on the roll & FX will actually "read" what color foil is in there. Some protection against some common user errors, I guess

FX foils have been designed to minimize the registration issue due to varied tensioning from varied roll lengths.

FX will be connected via a network port, not a parallel port. & there is to be improved diagnostic communications with the FX

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

More news as it becomes available.

 

[Barry]

The only negitive is its still to small... I find my 30" versacamm to small in a lot of cases.

 

[Dale Horn]

It doesn't look like $16,000 worth of machine to me.

 

[Jen Goodwin]

It doesn't look like $16,000 worth of machine to me.

That is exactly what I thought!
I wonder if there is any increased resolution with this or is it still 300 x 600?

 

[Marlene]

Will Gerber manufacture foils for both the Edge 1 & 2 or are we forced to buy a new machine?

 

[Fred Weiss]

Will Gerber manufacture foils for both the Edge 1 & 2 or are we forced to buy a new machine?

I can't imagine them not supplying the existing user base. Why would they concede that multi-million dollar piece of business to Duracoat and Zeronine?

My concern would be getting repairs to the older series of machines. I think they are required by federal law to service and support existing machines for seven years after the last one is either made or sold.

 

[Fred Weiss]

That is exactly what I thought!
I wonder if there is any increased resolution with this or is it still 300 x 600?

It's what comes out of the machine that matters .... not whether or not it weighs 100 pounds or 50 pounds. The speed and resolution are the same as the Edge 2. Benefits include refillable cartridges (unconfirmed), lower foil prices (unconfirmed), easier cartridge switching, improved color to color registration and foil remaining information.

 

[Dale Horn]

I guess you're right Fred, once a person ponies up the $20,000 for the machine and new foils and then runs it for awhile, the differences would be apparent. To me it triggers the question what else can be bought for the same money. How tough is the machine ?

Some people claim to do $100,000 a year with an Edge so it would be an acceptable cost. If that's the case - then there's really no debate.

There's also many that only do a few thousand and would be better off sub contracting the work. Lots of shops barely get their current machine paid for before the new model comes out.

A concern is this large volume is going to be alot more difficult to achieve as the inkjet print and cut systems grow. If a shop produces products that inkjet technology can't touch then earning potential of the machine is higher.

 

[Fred Weiss]

Seems like that would be true for just about any expenditure for your business. Comparatively, I can think of lots of places that might produce a better return in my business. OTOH, there's also no doubt in my mind that owning an Edge has generated a good return for me in the 75 months since I got mine.

Based on our little poll here, about half the members responding are doing less than $75,000 a year gross. I don't consider that figure high enough to justify a $30,000 commitment to one imaging system with supplies. In fact, the best businesses focus on marketing and then later buy the technology as it becomes cost justifiable. The worst businesses buy the technology in hopes that it will increase their sales.

It will be interesting to see where the inkjet technology currently being gobbled up by industry members takes us. My fear is that the majority are going without a laminator or even using clearcoat to protect their jobs .... buying into the "comparative ratings" being so liberally assigned to the inks and media.

I'm already seeing solvent prints off a Mimaki JV3 with Clearstar protective spray applied failing in a year of Florida sunlight.

 

[David Wright]

Fred, you are always the "grown-up" on all the boards you post to. Some good points made again as well.

For us, our shop bought a used edge system (LE) over 3 years ago for $7700. I like it but have not been able to utilize it for the increase in profits I would like. Realisticly we have made approximately $13,000 we wouldn't have made without it.
Is that good over 3 years, especially if I would have purchased new? Answer: no.

That is not blaming the product but the end user and maybe our shop's fit to this machine. All the more reason I would be hesitant to jump on the outdoor inkjet bandwagon.

Like you said, bad business to buy in hopes of improving sales. Sales should lead.

 

[Just Me]

i know this is kinda off-topic, but just this last fall we purchased a brand new Roland pc-12 (after hearing lots against it) it has paid for itself in a little over 3 months, doing all small decals, and diecast cars..point is..i guess it depends on how you market yourself and what you can consider doing for work

 

[Fred Weiss]

i know this is kinda off-topic, but just this last fall we purchased a brand new Roland pc-12 (after hearing lots against it) it has paid for itself in a little over 3 months, doing all small decals, and diecast cars..point is..i guess it depends on how you market yourself and what you can consider doing for work

My question to you then is do you have a good flow of sales & work into which you were able to add a new production device? And would you have still purchased the system if you had to buy it new?

My guess is that you do have a good sales & work flow that your experience was so good.

When I purchased my Edge I had been out of active signmaking for almost five years and had to reestablish myself. It was a long haul until I finally made the commitment to locate in an active retail location. This created a steady flow of work and the Edge became a solid moneymaker.... providing me a way to do work I would otherwise have had to outsource or turn away.

My point in relating it to gross sales volume is based on that experience and, of course is based on a brand new machine that hasn't even begun shipping.

Picking up used equipment is always an option for changing the economics of any business decision and if you are comfortable going without the normal support that comes with purchasing new equipment from a dealer. Another option is to get a job that you can use to pay for all or most of any equipment acquisition. I recently picked up a used laminator for $2500 that sells for $7000 new. But I had a $2200 order for decals that required lamination to put it against. Just yesterday I purchased a $370 table top metal and plastic shear because I have a 500 piece order for decals mounted on 3.75" x 3.75" aluminum with bleed edges. The 54" metal shear was too cumbersome to handle that many pieces.

 

[iSign]

I'm honored that the hearsay pasted above seemed well enough composed to surface over hear unchanged. I'll point out that it was written based on "hearsay" I recieved from 2 seperate very reliable sources, & edited once based on clarification from one source after posting... so it is pretty solid information IMO.

I can't comment much on the inkjet aspect of the equation, but for technology equal or superior to the Edge 2 at the price of an Edge 1... I would think people can still make some pretty good money with the FX. I do realize that the lower print cost of the newer print/cut options will effect that equation, but fortunatly, as far as I know nobody around here has that technology yet.

 

[Just Me]

My question to you then is do you have a good flow of sales & work into which you were able to add a new production device? And would you have still purchased the system if you had to buy it new?[QUOTE]

actually Fred we have a pretty good flow of business but we had done a couple of these small 1:24 scale diecast late model race cars for our current customers, after having done several of these and trying to layer the small sponsor decals with layered vinyl, we decided that their has to be a better way. We looked around quite a bit and decided to start with the PC-12 due to budget and due to the fact we were just getting our feet wet digitally and if it didnt work out, we wouldnt be out 20,000 dollars. Needless to say it has worked perfectly for what we needed and have now increased our overall business and revenue due to the fact of these 1:24 cars selling so good! I have attached a couple pics of a couple of our recent ones.

 

[Fred Weiss]

Here's the official information: Gerber Edge FX

 

[Dale Horn]

Needless to say it has worked perfectly for what we needed and have now increased our overall business and revenue due to the fact of these 1:24 cars selling so good! I have attached a couple pics of a couple of our recent ones.

Hey Outlaw, those cars are neat (and tedious to make?). What do they go for in your market?
Producing those small graphics would be problematic (registration issues) with a Edge LE, a person could get better resolution with the Edge 2 but the registration issue would need to be there.

They would make great sponsor trophies for the different types of races. Do you do the modified car up with the race sponsors identity and award it to the heat winner ?

 

[Marekdlux]

Thanks for the info on the Edge, Fred. Always keeping us up to date!

 

[arbys]

"I'm already seeing solvent prints off a Mimaki JV3 with Clearstar protective spray applied failing in a year of Florida sunlight"

Nice to hear some real skinny on solvent inkjets; I still believe in thermal for durability,
and I will for a long time.