Shrinkage after Contour Cutting - Advice needed

[Stratguru]

Hoping one of the experts can help out here.

We are getting shrinkage after printing and laminating. We produce small items, many designed for precise fit and losing up to 1/16th of an inch is unacceptable.

Equipment: Roland VSi printer, Seal 54EL Laminator, Summa Cutter.
Material: 3M IJ35C, NGlantz BeLam.

We have tried all the obvious stuff. 24 hour cure, virtually zero tension on Supply roll, 2 inches from surface for release liner take up.

Also, I know it's calendered material but we have had these done acceptably from a supplier before so we know it's something in our process that is causing the issue.

FYI, the Seal 54EL does not have a pressure adjustment which was a guess as a source of the problem.

The only other thought was speed. We are running through slowly. Maybe picking up speed?

Any help is greatly appreciated! Thanks so much.

 

[Desert_Signs]

belam. It's cheap and it shrinks.

 

[gabagoo]

I did about 25 parking signs last week and I cut them all at 12" x 18" printed and laminated. Not one of them fit correctly. My fault, I should have made the cut along the black borders instead of trying to cover the entire panel... Non printed calendered seems to shrink at a much slower rate but once you print on the stuff and expose it to the heaters..the shrinkage seems to speed up.

 

[Stratguru]

Thanks for the quick responses all.

I should have emphasized the main point that, using the material listed, my vendor was able to successfully print, lam and cut without any noticeable shrink.

So this proves that it can be done with the 35C and BeLam. With repeatability.

We have been unable to repeat, so it comes down to equipment or process, not material choice.

 

[Jester1167]

You have to use cast vinyl if you don't want shrinkage. Expensive calendared vinyl shrink less than the cheap ones but they still shrink a lot compared to cast vinyl.

Calendared vinyl starts it's life like a big ball of chewing gum and then rolled between rollers that get progressive thinner until reaches the desired thickness. It is under tension and pressure and as it cools it stabilizes. When it heats back up it has a tendency to shrink back.

Cast vinyl is sprayed on a web in liquid form. The continuous web is under tension not the cast vinyl. Cast vinyl has a lot of dimensional stability.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ei7VhjR33oQ

 

[Stratguru]

Also should mention we sell sheets of graphics to be applied by the purchaser. They get bagged and tagged for resale by our distributor. So shelf life is paramount. As it is now, the longer it sits, the more it shrinks. Up to 1/16th.

 

[Stratguru]

Again, please understand that it HAS been done before, for over 2 years, with no issues, with calendered material.

The only thing that has changed is we moved production in house.

 

[MikePro]

if you're hellbent on assuming that calendared 3M vinyl, and economy house-brand calendared overlaminate is good enough for your prodouct.... maybe try dialing-down the tension on your laminate feed? if you stretch calendared vinyl even the slightest bit during lamination, it WILL shrink within hours of application.

OR

if you really really want to save a buck, go with liquid laminate like ClearShield. won't shrink, only your vinyl will.

 

[Stratguru]

Just wanted to share a couple photos. The Black and Purple was printed Monday and the Silver was printed in December. Same material.

The thing that is frustrating is seeing it done, therefore knowing it can be done, and not being able to do it here.

Our tension is set almost to a free-wheel.

Could too much pressure cause this? Or too slow a speed?

Thanks again

 

[Stratguru]

If we decide to go with cast material, what do you guys think of the Arlon 4600? We need air release.

Like to find something around a $1-1.50 a sqft for material and lam combined.

Appreciate the advice.

 

[Jester1167]

Only two real options.

First make sure your prints cure at least over night before you laminate and cut them. This bulletin talks about it - multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/.../ij35-scotchcal-3-2-mil-film-pij-sp.pdf


But, more than likely your going to have to by a better grade of laminate at a minimum. There are 2 grades of calendared, polymeric and monomeric. Polymeric sas additives that help them resist shrinkage.

 

[Jester1167]

I just saw the purple and I bet your putting too much ink down. The bulletin I posted talks about this as well 250% is the total ink limit or the vinyl gets over saturated.

To illustrate what ink does to vinyl, grab an old ink cart and cut it open and drop a drop of ink on your IJ35 and see what it does to the vinyl. It will swell up/expand and wrinkle. As it dries it will go back close to its original state. Another example is to find a decal that you printed that has extreme light and dark areas (white text on a dark background works best. Flip the graphic face down and remove the liner. You should be able to see the areas the ink was heavy compared to no ink clearly from the adhesive side.

 

[woolly]

Very high ink load on to a air release vinyl can't comment on the lam but don't seam like a match it's adding up to problem
Your machine using different ink and profile may account for some of the difference

 

[oksigns]

The SEAL 54EL does have a pressure adjustment- it's the giant wheel to the right that adjusts height, and you can let off of it just a tiny bit.

I saw this myself in rare occasions with heavy ink coverages as pictured earlier in this thread.

So... it could be mostly temperature. You need to start with the right drying temp before, during and after printing, then disable the heat for cuts and it limits this shrinkage. The material is just in shock.

EDIT>>> i keep reading your tension is set to almost nothing, just make sure the film from the take up to the media is taught but not stretched

 

[DIGIXTRA]

That's because your printer using solvent ink..I believe. I don't know if latex ink will effect the vinyl, but UV printing is definitely not.

Hoping one of the experts can help out here.

We are getting shrinkage after printing and laminating. We produce small items, many designed for precise fit and losing up to 1/16th of an inch is unacceptable.

Equipment: Roland VSi printer, Seal 54EL Laminator, Summa Cutter.
Material: 3M IJ35C, NGlantz BeLam.

We have tried all the obvious stuff. 24 hour cure, virtually zero tension on Supply roll, 2 inches from surface for release liner take up.

Also, I know it's calendered material but we have had these done acceptably from a supplier before so we know it's something in our process that is causing the issue.

FYI, the Seal 54EL does not have a pressure adjustment which was a guess as a source of the problem.

The only other thought was speed. We are running through slowly. Maybe picking up speed?

Any help is greatly appreciated! Thanks so much.

 

[Jester1167]

To define if its and ink, material, or both problem, print out a row of 3" or 4" boxes. The first with no ink then progressively get darker to the darkest color you can print. Then follow you normal process; dry, laminate and then hand cut an X in the middle of each, set in in the sun for a few hours to speed up the process. Then bring it inside and take a look. It should help you define if it is a material problem or ink saturation problem.

 

[player]

Cast, better lam etc, also give the prints 48 hours to dry.