Impending death of script fonts?

[Pat Whatley]

So, something occurred to me this morning. Schools across the country are getting away from teaching cursive handwriting because it's no longer needed, 41 states have either done away with it or are not requiring it. If you remember the Travon Martin case there was a witness who was asked to read the statement she'd made but she couldn't because the person who wrote it down for her had written it in cursive and she'd never learned it. My kids school is no longer teaching it and honestly I think keyboarding skills are going to be more important to them in the long run. Heck, even my legal signature is more printed than cursive.

If kids in school now aren't learning cursive they're going to have trouble reading it. I was thinking it might be like Old English lettering but those letter forms are still basically the same as a standard Roman letter.

Are we a generation away from seeing beatiful, flowing script lettering go away because nobody can read it?

 

[John Butto]

bet she knows what this cursive writing says

 

[Dennis422]

If you did not see movie Wall-e, see it.

We are become those people from a spaceship.

And yes, no one will be able to read scrip very soon, kids nowadays can not even write correctly and I do not want to start about face-to-face communication.

 

[Gino]

I thought they were at least gonna teach all kids how to 'SIGN' their names, so important documents could not be forged. Do they realize how easy it is to forge print ?? Just another stoopid thing coming out of our schools. What will they think of next ?? Oh yeah, at a party yesterday... and the one lady was an ex-school teacher and still gets the latest news. They will soon be doing away with Geography, History and World History and some others in the very near future.

We're just down-sizing our children to the point we just have a bunch of stoopid people running around the streets, listening to all the lousy propaganda they dish out, so they can cultivate more voters.

• I'm glad I'm on my way out, but I really pity the smart kids that want to do their best and won't be given the chance.

Here ya go, we want a president in about 25 years that speaks ebonics, can't hand-write or know anything about his/her country, let alone where the various countries are on the map and only has to know what the weakest kid in the class knows...... huh ??

Something very familiar with this picture.
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[FireSprint.com]

I barely remember how to write cursive myself. I never use it. I can however read it. It is too bad, but at the same time, schools have finite resources and they must make tough decisions prioritizing the most important subjects they teach on. There aren't that many career paths or life events that require cursive.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

I barely remember how to write cursive myself. I never use it. I can however read it. It is too bad, but at the same time, schools have finite resources and they must make tough decisions prioritizing the most important subjects they teach on. There aren't that many career paths or life events that require cursive.

Not necessarily. The biggest root causes (in my opinion anyway) are the fact that you have to placate to the lowest denominator in the class room and the kids and the parents of the kids having more power in the class room then the teachers.

As incorrect PC as it is, your going to have some that aren't going to make the grade, no matter what you do. They either aren't going to try or they just aren't up to snuff (not their fault in some instances), but holding back others because of them isn't good.

There are just some things that should be passed on, not necessary for the direct value of finding a job. If that's the case, then we should stop teaching English in all it's forms by the 4th grade as the people that are out there in the work force now (even the ones with advanced degrees) don't possess communications (especially written) beyond that it seems.

I also don't know of any documentation that doesn't require both print and cursive forms of your name attached to it handwritten. Even if it's done on the cintiq and digitally transferred and printed. I will admit, I do more signatures on my Cintiq then I do on paper, but I still have to know how to do print and cursive. If you use a CC, you have to sign your name if you are physically making that purchase at the store.

 

[Fred Weiss]

If it happens, and I doubt it will, I think it will only be in the poorer performing school districts. Such an event will only serve to further divide our citizens along "have" and "have not" partisan lines. One could argue that there is no need for teaching English grammar, literature and spelling on the same grounds. And there is no reason to teach basic math when a smartphone can be used as an electronic calculator.

A few years back we tried to hire an employee and found that most of the applicants could not measure and were unable to answer basic questions like "How many inches in a foot?" or "How many feet in a yard?" or "How many square feet in a 4 x 8 sheet of plywood?" Yet, at the same time, we hear about all the young people going into years worth of debt to get a college education.

The ability to read a hand written note may turn out to be one of many things in the future that successful individuals will be able to do while those individuals who cannot will make up our lower economic rungs in society.

 

[Gino]

Hmmmm...... I wonder if we don't teach English, reading & writing, if there's a need to learn foreign languages ??

Maybe they're making room for the new language, Spanglish.
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[John Butto]

I feel I am living in a locker at a bus station, aka Men In Black, waiting for BOB to open it up and give us the wisdom on this subject.

 

[Cross Signs]

Education is simply the soul of a society as it passes from one generation to another.

Gilbert K. Chesterton

 

[Gino]

Education is simply the soul of a society as it passes from one generation to another.

Gilbert K. Chesterton

This is so true.






On another note, it was once said the fall & decline of any civilization is the decay of it's language. Language will fail first. All else, will closely follow.

 

[bob]

"I can read reading but I can't read writing" ...Popeye

As Ludwig Wittgenstein once said, sort of, "Things are what it makes sense to say about them'". He said this, of course, because old Ludwig was the founding father of 'Ordinary Language Analysis'. Bog knows what he would have said had he been a pudding manufacturer.

Nonetheless he said it and it has a certain correctness about it. Things are indeed what it makes sense to say about them. Following from this then one might say that a culture is defined by it's language, pretty much. Change the language and you change the culture. Worse, change the language and you change reality since you are changing what you say about things, that being what they are. Things, that is.

I find it sad that that there are a significant number of functional illiterates wandering about, driving on the highways, voting in elections, and handling the vegetables in the supermarket.

Language is the single thing that separates us from all other species on this planet. Humans or the only species extant that have ever, as in ever, been shown unequivocally to have language. 'Language' in this context being that system in which you think, not the various snorts and grunts used to articulate those thoughts. Language allows you to contemplate a future and reflect on a past, not merely exist in the here and now. The ability to contemplate a future, and likewise a past, implies the comprehension of time and of fiction. Incidentally, it's the concept of fiction enables you to lie.

In a very real sense language is what you are and as such should be taught, polished, and tuned at every opportunity. It seems a shame that the educational system these days gives every appearance of want to develop the student's cute personalities all the while insuring that none of them ever encounter anything deemed unpleasant in lieu of teaching them the language and arithmetic skills** that forever will define their lives. We or are descendents will pay for this insanity.

**language skills include being able to read and comprehend language in any form. Be it printed, written [preferably in a fine Spencerian hand], spoken, or scrawled in mayonnaise on a mirror. If you can't read, write, speak, and deal with basic arithmetic you are not a fully functional human. Note that mathematics merely is another, or perhaps an extension of, language.

 

[James Burke]

It's funny this topic should come up. Last evening, I came home from my Aunt's estate with a large box of hand written letters from the 1950s. There were love letters from old beaus whose cursive proved to be just as elegant as the fine hand of the gals; and their command of the king's English (and grammar) was equally as deft.

We're truly living in sad times, for sure.

But with that said, I believe that (as a lefty) I always struggled with making my cursive "lay" correctly. I tried an experiment one time where I wrote my cursive backward and then flipped the paper over to examine my writing. Yep...it looked almost perfect.

JB

 

[Marlene]

didn't they invent cursive as it made writing faster?

The origin of the cursive method is associated with practical advantages of writing speed and infrequent pen lifting to accommodate the limitations of the Quills are fragile, easily broken, and will spatter unless used properly. Steel dip pens followed quills; they were sturdier, but still had some limitations.

looked it up and seems like there was a good reason way back when to invent cursive writing but then we kind of kept it after problem solved. maybe time to say good by.

 

[Pat Whatley]

(Sanctimonious drivel deleted)

Is not teaching cursive in schools actually changing the language? It is a change in the presentation with zero impact on the message the words present. Cursive writing was developed to accommodate the limitations of quills. Since quills are very rarely used the need for cursive is negligible. While I firmly believe we should all be taught to write the need for two distinctly different methods seems overly redundant.

 

[shoresigns]

Note that most script fonts do not actually use cursive letters. They generally change the cursive letters to look more like regular letters, i.e. capital S, G and Q. This is because people already have difficulty reading cursive. Therefore, as long as typographers continue to make script fonts that are easy to read, I don't think script is going to die out (cursive on the other hand, is on its deathbed). There will always be a way to put a cursive/script/calligraphic "flourish" on standard, recognisable type.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

Is not teaching cursive in schools actually changing the language? It is a change in the presentation with zero impact on the message the words present. Cursive writing was developed to accommodate the limitations of quills. Since quills are very rarely used the need for cursive is negligible. While I firmly believe we should all be taught to write the need for two distinctly different methods seems overly redundant.

I don't know if it's necessarily redundant. Rather they are learning on the computers or reading it from paper. Unless you do get rid of the script fonts and have nothing but block, they are going to be limited as to what they are going to type if they can't recognize letters in the script font.

I can't speak for everyone, but the majority of time (only time I don't is when the line specifically calls for print), I write in cursive and I would say everyone that I deal with also does has well (with varying degrees of neatness). So as far as writing goes, cursive is the necessary one and print is the redundant one when it comes to writing and what I deal with. To me, the same strengths that cursive had with overcoming the weakness of quills apply to pens, pencils etc. Now, those instruments may not have the same weaknesses as quills, but the strength is still there.

However, regardless of all that, still at this time, while there exists two different styles (print, script) there needs to be at least the learning to recognize the characters otherwise that person (and you) are going to be limited in what you are able to do. After all, we use script (cursive) if your client (or their clients) can't read it?

I don't necessarily see this as a true "decay" of the language, but to me this is on par with not learning how draw using pencil/pen and paper but going straight to Ai/DRAW/Inkscape or instead of learning traditional painting mediums going straight to Painter/Photoshop. It's not a true "decay", but a natural progression, however, there is something lost if they don't learn about it. Even just possessing the knowledge about these, to me, is better then just totally ignoring.

 

[artbot]

in seventh grade my class was a part of a writing analysis test done by the state. we were taught d'nealian, as well as encouraged to hybrid our letter/script habits to what suited us best. this test went on for about three months. since then my handwriting has been the same. ...very quick and almost illegible.

 

[Fred Weiss]

The rumors of my death are greatly exaggerated.

Your friend,

Snapper

 

[Gino]

I think I hear many of you saying the need for cursive.... or learning cursive to read and write, may have come to an end because of computers and ease of reading. While I agree there's nothing harder than reading a doctor's prescription, to me it's lack of interest on some people's part while with others it just being lazy, which has turned into stoopidness. The school children today have no measure of standards when they remove almost everything about learning. When I was in school, you were tested and graded on penmanship. You needed a passing grade to move on. If you couldn't write in sentence form - in script by the end of the 3rd grade, you were held back. Horrible ?? Not at all. It was a subject and everyone with half a brain should learn to read and write. Can't convey your thoughts on a written piece of paper ?? Well, then how did you ever intend to make it in a world of everything written or printed for dummies ??

Why is it, any old letter or paper written before the 1980's you could basically read everything, but not so today ?? Simple. Pass every kid at any expense. Can't read ?? Probably can't write either, but who cares ?? Just get 'em through at all costs to his/her future. We have too many kids in the schools to clog them up with dummies. Just get 'em all out of school and let 'em find a job the best way they can. Oh, yeah, we'll figure out some kinda governmental angle for it later on.

What's that ?? They can't write their name ?? Isn't that what we did with the American Indians 150 years ago ?? Give 'em a mark. Didn't we teach them to fit it ?? Didn't they learn ?? Didn't every person coming through Ellis Island need to take a test on this stuff to some degree. Not only could those people speak, read and write their native tongue, but they had to LEARN English to a certain extent. We expect of some, but not our young. How terribly stoopid is that ??

There is no excuse for not learning something so easy and simple. To suggest removing a basic fundamental subject from our schools is pure nonsense. If they need something easier, than they should apply for a job digging holes and filling them back in or just get outta Dodge. Why should others stoopidity bring the whole nation to a screeching halt in the learning department ??

I for one, am very tired of giving into these weaklings. Wanna go around blaming the world for your problems, take a long hard look at yourself in the mirror and try to be honest with yourself.

I would bet my bottom dollar, those who say it's too hard to do the cursive/script thing... for the most part can't spell in print style either. Probably can't read much above a 2nd or 3rd grade level either.... and that's the fault of the kids who can but will be denied due to their selfishness.


One word.... SAD

...........and it's really sad because this can be beaten, but it's too frickin' hard.
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