Interesting Vendor conversation

[Slamdunkpro]

I recently needed to send an oversize banner out for printing. I found a wholesaler, ordered the job, got it produced and shipped and it arrived in a timely fashion. So far so good. We unpacked and started to unroll the banner when the fun started. It was really soft and was trying to stick together with some ink transfer from front to back (solvent banner). We carefully finished unrolling it and left it on the table to dry overnight. I looked at it again in the morning and while there was a little transfer, the face was still acceptable.

Here's where it got interesting. I called the wholesaler to let them know that we had some ink transfer and in the future, I'd prefer to get jobs a day later and fully cured vs having to reject an order due to ink transfer. I went out of my way to tell then that this wasn't a complaint, or any kind of request for compensation, just a heads up to them. For my trouble I was treated to a diatribe of "that banner was fully dry", "what you are describing is impossible" "That never happens" and basically "you are an idiot". Okay, guess you don't need my business anymore.

Sometimes you just gotta wonder.

 

[CL Graphics]

was this a merchant member here.

 

[Marlene]

did you take some photos of the ink transfer? if so, send them to the vendor as it may be of help to them. it sounds like the vendor thinks all is OK and since it seems like there could be issues, you would think they would want to know.

 

[B Snyder]

When are people going to learn there is a difference between being dry and being cured?

 

[Marlene]

When are people going to learn there is a difference between being dry and being cured?

what is the difference? I thought to cure was to dry, is it something else? (I don't do this kind of printing and have no idea)

 

[Slamdunkpro]

did you take some photos of the ink transfer? if so, send them to the vendor as it may be of help to them. it sounds like the vendor thinks all is OK and since it seems like there could be issues, you would think they would want to know.

Done and done. You'd think they'd want to know, clearly the guy I spoke with was not a "people person".

 

[Gino]

Time to look for someone else.

Don't waste your time arguing with someone that won't listen to reasoning.

Mistakes happen and regardless of it being their fault or yours..... no one needs a lecture. I've done the same thing recently with a supplier. I ordered a large quantity of Cor-X. It came in.... a day late I might add..... and all banged up and told them they need to take better care of shipping. Their reply was... it's only corroplast.... what do you expect. It's cheep stuff. We don't handle it the same way we do sintra or other expensive products. Now, how do I tell MY customer that ??

 

[B Snyder]

what is the difference? I thought to cure was to dry, is it something else? (I don't do this kind of printing and have no idea)

Drying = evaporation of the solvent
Curing = the polymerization of the ink

 

[Billct2]

My non-scientific explaination...
Like paint, it may be dry to touch but not "hard" (cured).
This is particuarly an issue when rolling a banner or stacking prints.
They're still "soft" and outgassing and when the "fumes" are trapped they start to reactivate the ink/paint to the point of making it sticky.

 

[Marlene]

Drying = evaporation of the solvent
Curing = the polymerization of the ink

thanks for the info. wouldn't either be a way of making the ink not sticky or would allow for ink transfer?

Done and done. You'd think they'd want to know, clearly the guy I spoke with was not a "people person".

that's too bad. I hate dealing with a company that you can't talk to when there's an issue. there are plenty of good vendors out there, so it will be their loss to not listen.

 

[B Snyder]

thanks for the info. wouldn't either be a way of making the ink not sticky or would allow for ink transfer?

No. As I explained, drying and curing are two different things. Being dry and non-sticky does not tell you that complete polymerization (or curing) has occurred.

 

[cfbeagle]

The ink can be dry to the touch but if ink touches ink (printed area touches printed area) anytime within 24-48 hours it can cure together. Then if you pull it apart it's not pretty.:scream:

 

[StopSignGraphics]

Wow that sounds like a response from my old employer... is the vendor located in NC?

~Chris

 

[Pat Whatley]

Sounds like the over-reaction I got from Fellers years ago. We had a roll of JASDI magnetic that was sticking to cars like it was decal I called the people at JASDI and the tech I got on the phone said immediately that they'd had a manufacturing problem and that they were taking care of damages. I was shocked at how helpful and honest they were about it.

I mentioned it to the people at Fellers the next time I ordered stuff since I'd bought the magnetic from them. They went into automatic defense mode giving me 30 different reasons it was my fault or my customers fault and couldn't possibly be the magnetic. I kept telling the a-hole that THE PEOPLE WHO MADE THE MAGNETIC said it was the magnetic and were taking care of the problems. I didn't want anything at all out of Fellers, I was just trying to give them a heads up, they just automatically went into "cover our ass" mode.

 

[TheSnowman]

...they just automatically went into "cover our ass" mode.

I got a bad roll of Magnum I think it was from them once...and it wouldn't hang onto a car if it had to. They shipped me another one (free shipping of course) and paid to ship the other one back. Just shipping something that weighs 60+lbs...they ate it pretty good...but never asked any questions or gave me a hassle, just made it right.

 

[cmyimage]

another reason is that. Inks stick less easily to banner materials with low-surface energy,(bad banner material) or the ink can not fully polymerization because the ink is not really solvent or eco-solvent (bad ink). Color will fade soon Like dye-base ink.

 

[SqueeGee]

When we order large prints like that from a wholesaler, they usually lay down a layer of waxy kraft paper before they fold it and ship it to me, I assume to prevent the issue you described.