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12' Tall 8' Wide Post frame sign

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Bud Kistner

New Member
We've got two signs to bid and install and I'm curious on the best method for the frame and foundation.
The signs will likely be 3 panels stacked vertically to create a 8' wide x 12' tall image. I am considering using 4x4 or 4x6 posts going 3 - 4 feet in the ground and running support beams between the posts for something to attach the sign to. Lastly using stakes and cables + turnbuckles running from the top corners of the sign to the ground to hopefully help prevent wind from blowing these giant panels down.
Any suggestions would be very helpful!
 
rjssigns

rjssigns

Active Member
For wind load specs check with your city's engineering department. Wind load for my location is 30 pounds per square foot. They will also have soil specs which are equally as important. When I was still doing those types of signs I way overbuilt. Always went the next size up for posts then set in concrete.

Wind load for my area with 10% over comes to 3,168lbs of force.
 
Billct2

Billct2

Active Member
If your area requires permit with engineering stamp you should ask the engineer. If no permits required I always overbuild I'd use at least 6"x6" with 2x4 stringers but would probably switch to steel posts with angle iron top and bottom. Here I'd be a minimum of 3 foot down in concrete. Cables are messy looking and only require more footings. If you do it right no need for them.
 
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Bud Kistner

New Member
Gino said:
Is this single or double sided ??
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It will be double sided. I'm not getting a bit of price shock so I'm thinking they will likely scale it back down to 8x8. Wondering if using an Ackland Banner frame and 13oz rather than ACM panels would be lighter a lighter and cheaper option.... Thank you for all of the helpful replies!
 
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unclebun

Active Member
If you're going to the expense of setting poles in the ground, why waste that effort putting up banners on the structure? It'll look like crap and they still will have spent a couple thousand on it. In the end, you're talking about the difference between a few $128 banners and a few $250-$450 signs.
 
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Bud Kistner

New Member
unclebun said:
If you're going to the expense of setting poles in the ground, why waste that effort putting up banners on the structure? It'll look like crap and they still will have spent a couple thousand on it. In the end, you're talking about the difference between a few $128 banners and a few $250-$450 signs.
Click to expand...

Looks like they are going to go with 1 double sided sign. Likely going to use alumacor for the panels to save on weight. Doing the math on 12' tall sign + 2' off the ground + 3' in the ground I am going to need at least a 17' post. I don't think I would be able to lift or get a 6x6 post vertical at that length so I might have to go with 4x4's... Thanks for all the input.
 
Gino

Gino

Premium Subscriber
I don't know where you're located, but a 100 sq ft sail 14' in the air will never be supported or accepted by ANY building code in this country. Especially a 4" x 4" post. Even a 6" x 6" will most likely need to go in the ground 5 to 6 feet. When you apply for your permit, they'll tell you to get an engineers stamped drawing. If you don't, you're opening yourself up to a lotta problems. A good wind will snap 4" x 4"s off where it meets the sign or the ground in no time. I saw you mention going down to possibly a 8' x 8'. That still won't cut it.
 
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Bud Kistner

New Member
Gino said:
I don't know where you're located, but a 100 sq ft sail 14' in the air will never be supported or accepted by ANY building code in this country. Especially a 4" x 4" post. Even a 6" x 6" will most likely need to go in the ground 5 to 6 feet. When you apply for your permit, they'll tell you to get an engineers stamped drawing. If you don't, you're opening yourself up to a lotta problems. A good wind will snap 4" x 4"s off where it meets the sign or the ground in no time. I saw you mention going down to possibly a 8' x 8'. That still won't cut it.
Click to expand...
Thank you
 
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Bud Kistner

New Member
Gino said:
I don't know where you're located, but a 100 sq ft sail 14' in the air will never be supported or accepted by ANY building code in this country. Especially a 4" x 4" post. Even a 6" x 6" will most likely need to go in the ground 5 to 6 feet. When you apply for your permit, they'll tell you to get an engineers stamped drawing. If you don't, you're opening yourself up to a lotta problems. A good wind will snap 4" x 4"s off where it meets the sign or the ground in no time. I saw you mention going down to possibly a 8' x 8'. That still won't cut it.
Click to expand...
We did have an 8x8 at the same site that did just fine until a contractor pulled it down due to it being in their way. It was 4x4 framed and had some cables coming off from the top corners staked into the ground. I can most likely talk them into putting the sign closer to the ground maybe 12" or so.
 
Gino

Gino

Premium Subscriber
And you were able to obtain permits for that ?? Your drawings indicated only in the ground 3 feet ?? With 4×4's ??
 
Texas_Signmaker

Texas_Signmaker

Very Active Signmaker
Home builders use sizes like that all the time here, with 6"x6". We have constant high winds. They don't use cables.. they use 2x4's or 4x4's at a 45 degree angle as stabilizers. I refaced one last year, of I can find a pic of frame I'll post it.

Here is a short one. I've seen them much higher using 6x6s.

20190412_141246.jpg
 
White Haus

White Haus

Not a Newbie
Texas_Signmaker said:
Home builders use sizes like that all the time here, with 6"x6". We have constant high winds. They don't use cables.. they use 2x4's or 4x4's at a 45 degree angle as stabilizers. I refaced one last year, of I can find a pic of frame I'll post it.

Here is a short one. I've seen them much higher using 6x6s.

View attachment 153334
Click to expand...

Is that coroplast with only stringers @ 4'?!? That would explain the missing fourth panel lol.
 
Gino

Gino

Premium Subscriber
Dead man posts are pretty good, but when you have a sign 15' in the air with 100 sq ft heavy substrate, what happens if the wind comes from the opposite direction ?? Anything much over 8' or 10' needs to buried much further and ya need much more girth.
 
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