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4x8 post and panel install. Concrete or not?
- Thread starter Schoensignsgraphics
- Start date
CanuckSigns
Active Member
What does the building department reccomend on your permit application?
Schoensignsgraphics
New Member
Outside of town on private property in a rural area. No permit needed.
Texas_Signmaker
Very Active Signmaker
I always use concrete, but our soil is loose and it's silly how our telephone poles are crooked all over the place.
Johnny Best
Active Member
Kansas can get some high winds, Dorothy, like Gino said 40"deep with two bags each hole to be safe.
Some say just use a heavy pry bar and tamp dirt down good all the way around posts in the holes if it is temporary.
Some say just use a heavy pry bar and tamp dirt down good all the way around posts in the holes if it is temporary.
Billct2
Active Member
I do 4x8s on 4X4 posts with a bag of crete in each hole and never had a problem. 6x6 with crete is going nowhere. When I first started the guy I worked for never used concrete for jobs like that, 36" deep holes and compact the hell out of the fill (which always had rocks), concrete is easier, especially the new no mix stuff
I never use concrete when I can dig deep enough. Code here is 42 inches but the frost often goes deeper so I always dig 4 feet. If I can’t go deep enough I always use concrete. Another variable is height of the sign and as mentioned soil condition. Loose soil would probably require concrete. Old rule of thumb: one third of pole length underground, two thirds above ground. The taller the sign the higher the wind load.
We use rapid post for everything we dig into the ground that's not temporary.
https://www.rona.ca/en/rapid-post
Adds maybe $20-30 to a sign install and all but guarantees it won't fall over when a group of kids is hanging off of it.
https://www.rona.ca/en/rapid-post
Adds maybe $20-30 to a sign install and all but guarantees it won't fall over when a group of kids is hanging off of it.
Texas_Signmaker
Very Active Signmaker
I'm confused. Is it concrete that dries faster??
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dale911
President
It’s post set concrete that is set in about 20 minutes or so. You pour it around the post dry. I usually pour it in and pack it into place with everything plumb and then some people will leave it and walk to let moisture from the ground or rain finish it but I pour water over it and then throw some dirt over that so grass will grow around the post.
In Indiana , it’s pretty common to just run them into the ground 24” for street signs, 4x8 temp signs and things. I dig a hole last week down 24” that I couldn’t even get the auger to drill. I had to chisel it with a hole digger because the clay was so hard and compacted. I personally won’t do any sign posts that are large and permanent because they can’t pay me enough to dig a hole that deep. As a wholesale installer, I would want $300-500 per post if I can’t auger it but I’m old and would rather be in the shop running the printers or in the bucket making service call money.
In Indiana , it’s pretty common to just run them into the ground 24” for street signs, 4x8 temp signs and things. I dig a hole last week down 24” that I couldn’t even get the auger to drill. I had to chisel it with a hole digger because the clay was so hard and compacted. I personally won’t do any sign posts that are large and permanent because they can’t pay me enough to dig a hole that deep. As a wholesale installer, I would want $300-500 per post if I can’t auger it but I’m old and would rather be in the shop running the printers or in the bucket making service call money.
Texas_Signmaker
Very Active Signmaker
Tell me about... This summer, the ground has got so hard that I have to use a concrete stabber metal pole thing to dig the dirt up... I even tried a hammer drill with a large concrete bit attached to it.. (Yes, I was desperate)
I have to do another sign this week...I'm hoping Arlington got in on that rain last week and maybe softened the ground up... I can't take much more of this hard dirt.
I have to do another sign this week...I'm hoping Arlington got in on that rain last week and maybe softened the ground up... I can't take much more of this hard dirt.
Yes, it's a quick dry concrete . Made for fence posts / sign posts.
We use 2 bags per post... Sometimes 3 if we dig deep enough. Each bag is 50lb.. so you're adding about 100lb+ of weight to each post. It helps make sure the sign doesn't shift when the ground gets wet als
That said your adding 200lb to the signs weight. So when / if you need to remove it... You'll be chipping away at cement to do it. So it's good for permanent fixtures only.
We do a lot of rain garden signs. So areas where the ground is made of soil, and gets drenched every day. Usually they're at schools... So there will be kids hanging off them, jumping off them, etc. Never have we had one tip or shift.
We use 2 bags per post... Sometimes 3 if we dig deep enough. Each bag is 50lb.. so you're adding about 100lb+ of weight to each post. It helps make sure the sign doesn't shift when the ground gets wet als
That said your adding 200lb to the signs weight. So when / if you need to remove it... You'll be chipping away at cement to do it. So it's good for permanent fixtures only.
We do a lot of rain garden signs. So areas where the ground is made of soil, and gets drenched every day. Usually they're at schools... So there will be kids hanging off them, jumping off them, etc. Never have we had one tip or shift.
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brycesteiner
New Member
for temporary I don't use any. We use bags of concrete and we just pour it in dry and let the rain do it's job. We use it to pack it down on the bottom and use that as the leveling agent too.
bannertime
Active Member
We did get some decent rain. Still sitting water in some spots. Lucky. Just about a week ago we had to water some holes for a few hours just to finish the last 18 inches with an auger.
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New Member
ams
New Member
We have red clay and strong dirt. But I still don't see how 6X6's look better. Are you building an entire framing system? or just using brackets and putting between the posts?