wrapman jamz
New Member
Yo Adrian, grease da palm an' we let cha keep da wrap.....capische?
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fellers platinum packages
- Thread starter MafiaWraps
- Start date
benjercorp
New Member
Welcome from Miami!!!
Here are my estimates for new equipment all in the 60"-64" ballpark (estimate prices, but you might find them lower):
Printer (Mimaki, Roland, Epson, or Mutoh) = $20K (should come with RIP software)
Laminator (Royal Sovereign RSC-1650H) = $6,500
Cutting Plotter (Graphtec FC8000-160) = $6,100
Adobe Creative Suite Premium (you'll want Photoshop for wraps) = $1,800
First rolls of cast vinyl & laminate = $1,100 (right now you can find better deals)
If you buy your printer from a source like Advantage Sign Supply or Grimco (and I'm sure others do this), you'll get a nice sample pack of vinyl and laminate. Should give you enough to test and figure out what you like. Throw in about $500 of for misc tapes, squeegees, rags, torches, needed solvent/fluids, and other random things you'll need and your around $36K for a nice set up. If you get need computers for RIP and/or design, round up to $40K. Sure, you could get a $20K Seal laminator but you can spend much less and get something that will serve you well. There are MANY wrap shops using the equipment I've listed and miles of wrap vinyl have gone through RS laminators. I haven't looked at the Feller's package but what I've listed will be a great start and something you won't regret in a couple of years. Just my $0.02.
Allen
Printer (Mimaki, Roland, Epson, or Mutoh) = $20K (should come with RIP software)
Laminator (Royal Sovereign RSC-1650H) = $6,500
Cutting Plotter (Graphtec FC8000-160) = $6,100
Adobe Creative Suite Premium (you'll want Photoshop for wraps) = $1,800
First rolls of cast vinyl & laminate = $1,100 (right now you can find better deals)
If you buy your printer from a source like Advantage Sign Supply or Grimco (and I'm sure others do this), you'll get a nice sample pack of vinyl and laminate. Should give you enough to test and figure out what you like. Throw in about $500 of for misc tapes, squeegees, rags, torches, needed solvent/fluids, and other random things you'll need and your around $36K for a nice set up. If you get need computers for RIP and/or design, round up to $40K. Sure, you could get a $20K Seal laminator but you can spend much less and get something that will serve you well. There are MANY wrap shops using the equipment I've listed and miles of wrap vinyl have gone through RS laminators. I haven't looked at the Feller's package but what I've listed will be a great start and something you won't regret in a couple of years. Just my $0.02.
Allen
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Dan Antonelli
New Member
On a unrelated note, I find it ironic that so many shops are quick to spend $35k on wrap equipment, software, etc - yet think $5k for a properly designed web site - that actually brings in work to run those machines - is too expensive.
And somewhat on-topic since you are in PA - Google 'vehicle wraps PA'. The first two are our clients sites. Probably paid for their sites within a month or two of launching.
And somewhat on-topic since you are in PA - Google 'vehicle wraps PA'. The first two are our clients sites. Probably paid for their sites within a month or two of launching.
Good point Dan. I think it would safe to say that many start-up businesses spend money on equipment, shop/store space, etc...but don't spend money on promotional materials and advertising. MafiaWraps might have a different situation. Sounds like he runs a successful business doing window tinting and other car customizations and views wraps as an extension of that business.
Allen
TheSnowman
New Member
I'm with the sub it out crowd on this one. It's a big investment when you are just starting into digital. Had I found S101 before I bought my printer, I probably wouldn't have bought it, or would have at least gone smaller than a 54". We've only done a couple partial wraps, but I think I'd sub it if I had to do a full one. I don't like to stock that much wrap material, and just have it sit, and I don't have the space to lay it all out to dry, and then to laminate it, and store it again.
The MM's here are so good, and most are so responsible and set up for this kind of thing, you can't hardly justify your own sometimes. If I could do it over...I'd just sub it, and keep my printer payment in my pocket.
The MM's here are so good, and most are so responsible and set up for this kind of thing, you can't hardly justify your own sometimes. If I could do it over...I'd just sub it, and keep my printer payment in my pocket.
mark galoob
New Member
hey mafia wraps dude,
you already have a built in client base of 26 yrs in the business right...i think its a no brainer...
mind, there will be a huge learning curve and you are going to waste a bunch of material, and ink at first, but it sounds like you already have a home for the equipment...
personnelly i think a 54" set up will do you fine...why do you need anything any larger. also, you should do a search of fellers on this forum... we went with advantage and bought equip at a show and got a great deal on it with all the bells whistles and most important WARANTEE...
it seems that a lot of people on this site will try to scare you off from moving into this direction, maybe they are scared of competition...
its also a great time to buy but id wait till right before new yr...everybody will be trying to unload equipment...
mark galoob
you already have a built in client base of 26 yrs in the business right...i think its a no brainer...
mind, there will be a huge learning curve and you are going to waste a bunch of material, and ink at first, but it sounds like you already have a home for the equipment...
personnelly i think a 54" set up will do you fine...why do you need anything any larger. also, you should do a search of fellers on this forum... we went with advantage and bought equip at a show and got a great deal on it with all the bells whistles and most important WARANTEE...
it seems that a lot of people on this site will try to scare you off from moving into this direction, maybe they are scared of competition...
its also a great time to buy but id wait till right before new yr...everybody will be trying to unload equipment...
mark galoob
One other thing to add....if you go with Feller's you have no choice of the brand of printer, laminator, or cutter. On the cutter, you'll probably go with Graphtec anyway but you might want something other than Mutoh and Seal for your printer and laminator. There's nothing wrong with those brands I just prefer to have options. We have purchased our equipment from Advantage. Mutoh, Mimaki, & Epson on solvent printers and RS, Seal, and GBC for laminators. They also carry Graphtec and Mimaki cutters. I just think it is nice to have choices which will give you more than one option in your given price range.
Allen
Allen
kstompaint
New Member
2 years ago I was in your shoes. I too had an established business that I wanted to expand. You seem to have the customer base, work ethic and experience to make this a success. I researched the equipment first and then the distributors. I determined that the Mutoh and Graphtec were going to fit my needs. The Seal was a little more than I was looking to spend, but it is an extremely stout piece of equipment.
We went to the SGIA show so that we could look at the equipment side by side and talk directly to the distributors. I ended up buying from Fellers. If you are serious, these distributors WILL negotiate. The "Platinum Package" may be over kill, but that's up to you. Turn-key is nice if you can afford it.
Fellers sent techs to install everything and show us the basics. We were pretty green to much of it and there was a learning curve, but it's really not that bad. Fellers in-house techs are extremely available, giving us their cell numbers and answering at 10 p.m. and on weekends. They stood behind the equipment better than any manufacturer. I have nothing to gain from promoting Fellers, but the truth is support after the buy is everything and theirs is top notch.
As for 54" printers... spend the $ to be able to print 60". You'll emliminate a lot of seems.
We went to the SGIA show so that we could look at the equipment side by side and talk directly to the distributors. I ended up buying from Fellers. If you are serious, these distributors WILL negotiate. The "Platinum Package" may be over kill, but that's up to you. Turn-key is nice if you can afford it.
Fellers sent techs to install everything and show us the basics. We were pretty green to much of it and there was a learning curve, but it's really not that bad. Fellers in-house techs are extremely available, giving us their cell numbers and answering at 10 p.m. and on weekends. They stood behind the equipment better than any manufacturer. I have nothing to gain from promoting Fellers, but the truth is support after the buy is everything and theirs is top notch.
As for 54" printers... spend the $ to be able to print 60". You'll emliminate a lot of seems.
I realize that you (the original poster) are only asking about equipment and thus the advice that I'm going to share is unsolicited but please hear me out.
Clearly you've been in the tint business for over two decades and have made a comfortable living from it. I think there is little doubt that you have the technical foundation necessary to wrap a vehicle with vinyl.
I think, however, you're grossly underestimating the challenges in starting a vehicle wraps business.
Over the years I have had clients ask if we also do everything from tinting to painting, t-shirts, embroidery, and web design just to name a few. And you know what? Technically, I have no doubt that we could do all those things. Realistically though, we would not do any of those things very well.
Before dropping $20,000 to $50,000 in the midst of your entrepreneurial seizure, take a week to read to read E-myth by Michael Gerber and Good to Great by Jim Collins. Also consider dropping $7 for 30 days on a premium subscription and learn all that you can about the recent market and pricing trends for wraps.
Good luck!
Clearly you've been in the tint business for over two decades and have made a comfortable living from it. I think there is little doubt that you have the technical foundation necessary to wrap a vehicle with vinyl.
I think, however, you're grossly underestimating the challenges in starting a vehicle wraps business.
Over the years I have had clients ask if we also do everything from tinting to painting, t-shirts, embroidery, and web design just to name a few. And you know what? Technically, I have no doubt that we could do all those things. Realistically though, we would not do any of those things very well.
Before dropping $20,000 to $50,000 in the midst of your entrepreneurial seizure, take a week to read to read E-myth by Michael Gerber and Good to Great by Jim Collins. Also consider dropping $7 for 30 days on a premium subscription and learn all that you can about the recent market and pricing trends for wraps.
Good luck!
Jim Doggett
New Member
Hi Mafia,
FatCat has the equipment I'd choose: Mutoh Valuejet running on a Wasatch RIP ... the print quality is amazing. (Real amazing) Someone mentioned a 60" print width, which is a nice luxury. But 54" gets you there, nicely ... a 48" leaves seams on the hoods of vehicles, and is probably a bit too narrow. Spending extra on a top-notch laminator is a good idea, IMO. Seal if you can afford it.
Many have mentioned cutters. But the wrap shops (heavy duty ones) I've visited have cutters gathering dust. Vehicle wraps is a print, laminate and apply business, with apply being the trickier ... techniques can be learned for a fee, or by trial and error (many errors to start).
A heat-gun is more forgiving than a torch, but the pros are all using torches, as best as I can tell. Temperature is king (material) with all the high tech films. So to get optimal media performance, a temperature reading gizmo (infrared temp gun) is good to have.
Finally some serious computing horsepower to run Photoshop with giant files ... and then a vector program that suits your tastes (Corel, Illustrator, whatever).
My $0.02,
Jim
FatCat has the equipment I'd choose: Mutoh Valuejet running on a Wasatch RIP ... the print quality is amazing. (Real amazing) Someone mentioned a 60" print width, which is a nice luxury. But 54" gets you there, nicely ... a 48" leaves seams on the hoods of vehicles, and is probably a bit too narrow. Spending extra on a top-notch laminator is a good idea, IMO. Seal if you can afford it.
Many have mentioned cutters. But the wrap shops (heavy duty ones) I've visited have cutters gathering dust. Vehicle wraps is a print, laminate and apply business, with apply being the trickier ... techniques can be learned for a fee, or by trial and error (many errors to start).
A heat-gun is more forgiving than a torch, but the pros are all using torches, as best as I can tell. Temperature is king (material) with all the high tech films. So to get optimal media performance, a temperature reading gizmo (infrared temp gun) is good to have.
Finally some serious computing horsepower to run Photoshop with giant files ... and then a vector program that suits your tastes (Corel, Illustrator, whatever).
My $0.02,
Jim
MafiaWraps
New Member
Well thank you all mates!!!!!!! It was great hearing all the honest opinions. Its easy to pick out the serious players on this board. I read a window tinting board all the time and the big hitters stand out with their advice. The ones that dont think you should be in the biz, stand out even more. I have a 23 year old client base. That means, every executive in down has their cars tinted, clear bras installed by me, I've tinted their homes and their offices. I have em asking all the time if i got the equipment yet. Is it a sure thing with no learning curve???? Absolutley not!!!!! Im gonna trash tons of material i reckon. When I first went professional as a tinter as a carreer, I damn well bet I destroyed 15k in tint to perfect my art, I've thrown out thousands in clear bra urethane to get it right. I do not piss around in my industry, im always set on kill. We work very hard to keep a stellar little shop clean because we demand the high prices.
I would love if somebody had the name of the cat in ohio who had the fellers package on ebay that ended saturday. I missed the auction and have an interest in contacting him.
I do agree with the fella about the website comment as well. I have blown alot of money on little designers to get ummmmmmm NOWHERE , when in fact if I would have taken all the money that i lost on them, I could of had a helluva done that did its job!!!!
You are only as good as your tools at hand, PERIOD!!!!!!!
I would love if somebody had the name of the cat in ohio who had the fellers package on ebay that ended saturday. I missed the auction and have an interest in contacting him.
I do agree with the fella about the website comment as well. I have blown alot of money on little designers to get ummmmmmm NOWHERE , when in fact if I would have taken all the money that i lost on them, I could of had a helluva done that did its job!!!!
You are only as good as your tools at hand, PERIOD!!!!!!!
k.a.s.
New Member
Since your in PA buy a Mumaki and a Seal from Pioneer Supply, they are awesome. No need to look anywhere else. Prices are always in line and the techs are awesome.
Kevin
Jim Doggett
New Member
"I do agree with the fella about the website comment as well. I have blown alot of money on little designers to get ummmmmmm NOWHERE , when in fact if I would have taken all the money that i lost on them, I could of had a helluva done that did its job!!!!"
Spend even less and use www.Volusion.com ... use the basic templates or let them design for you. Plus the backend e-commerce is second to none ... for about $50 / month.
JMO
Spend even less and use www.Volusion.com ... use the basic templates or let them design for you. Plus the backend e-commerce is second to none ... for about $50 / month.
JMO
Dan Antonelli
New Member
The problem doesn't lie in the money spent, it lies in whom the money was spent with. To suggest a template solution infers that a templated option would help him achieve good SEO success on his own, and I would strongly disagree with that advice.
A template solution also will be challenging to use to further his own brand - since by definition - it is a template.
You can say you get what you pay for - and usually that works out - unless you hire the wrong person regardless of what they're charging.
Jim Doggett
New Member
Hi Dan,
I get what you're saying. Indeed, SEO is a big deal. So more and more, the turnkey IHPs are adding some pretty nice SEO devices; Volusion does, quite well. I can do better than Volusion ... but I'm a student of the craft ... and I can only do a little better.
Plus, most sign companies are local businesses ... Adwords and Google Checkout is cheap and easy for cred with the close-in market. If you're national, then Adwords gets spendy.
Mainly, just make sure that page titles and descriptions are about the page, not copied-and-pasted from the Home Page. If you get traffic, you'll get page one results pretty quickly ... without spending a bunch of dough.
IMHO,
Jim
I get what you're saying. Indeed, SEO is a big deal. So more and more, the turnkey IHPs are adding some pretty nice SEO devices; Volusion does, quite well. I can do better than Volusion ... but I'm a student of the craft ... and I can only do a little better.
Plus, most sign companies are local businesses ... Adwords and Google Checkout is cheap and easy for cred with the close-in market. If you're national, then Adwords gets spendy.
Mainly, just make sure that page titles and descriptions are about the page, not copied-and-pasted from the Home Page. If you get traffic, you'll get page one results pretty quickly ... without spending a bunch of dough.
IMHO,
Jim
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All you Need is a Roland VP540, Royal Soveirgn Laminator, CorelDraw or Photoshop or Software that you prefer to use. And A starter kit 1 roll of vinyl and 1 roll of laminate. Make Your own Designs, Since you have you own designer (Plus Every Client is Different). But First I would sub out the work and see if the means justify the ends. Also if you are a tinter, then it shouldn't be to hard to learn. Test on your own vehicle first, Also DON'T Cheap Out on the MATERIAL, or you will get BURNED.
MafiaWraps
New Member
i never ever cheap out on material. It will always burn your ass in the end!!!!!!. I am working on the financing right now. I feel the install will be a learning curve but I'm well prepared to tackle
VINYL WRAPER
New Member
I agree with most of you on this. Fellers package is priced high with alot of extras you realy don't need. Is Fellers still installing the equipment with trained techs?
I belive the best way to get started is to sub out the printing.
I do have a question for the form....... Where is a good place to get training for car and fleet wraps with out selling my left leg to pay for it?
I belive the best way to get started is to sub out the printing.
I do have a question for the form....... Where is a good place to get training for car and fleet wraps with out selling my left leg to pay for it?