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Hey Fellers and Montroy.
- Thread starter HulkSmash
- Start date
We spend thousands of dollars with fellers every month... sometimes tens of thousands and that's just a single month. A one-off customer could never make up for the business fellers would lose if I decided to do business elsewhere... and if things don't change, that will happen. I have emailed over 100 shops to inform them about this business practice... they aren't just losing one retailer, they are losing tens of dozens and already have. In the process I have discovered that many of Fellers biggest retailers have already stopped doing business with them for this specific reason. An average wrap shop will purchase well over $100K worth of product from a single distributor in one year.
Techman
New Member
fellers has always sold directly to anyone who calls them. Its been like this for at least a few years. Nothing new here except now it is out of the closet.
And then, vinyl signs are almost dead. I was at a local supplier and they sold some vinyl to a new user. The 15 yd box had dust on it from sitting so long. And, they sold to this new cash sale user at wholesale. He was so new he didn't know know vinyl came in many colors other than red white and blue.
So we can have our war dances and grand mal hissy fits all we want. It's been going on for a long time with about half of the suppliers.
And then, vinyl signs are almost dead. I was at a local supplier and they sold some vinyl to a new user. The 15 yd box had dust on it from sitting so long. And, they sold to this new cash sale user at wholesale. He was so new he didn't know know vinyl came in many colors other than red white and blue.
So we can have our war dances and grand mal hissy fits all we want. It's been going on for a long time with about half of the suppliers.
and these are the distributors businesses like myself won't do business with. While fellers may have always sold to anyone, they never openly discussed this. Now it is out in the open for everyone to see. Their catalog used to require an account number in order to view pricing. A reputable distributor will use professional courtesy and protect their retail businesses. This business practice leaves us all to fend for ourselves. Not only does this control the market, but it will ruin profits and cut into other costs.
bikecomedy
New Member
Wondering why it seemed like about five or so new people joined here a day. Thought it was strange to have that many new sign shops. Is it a retailing cowboy selling to an information hungry public flooding the industry or just lack of work in a job hungry nation that is now focused on price and not quality?
Fred Weiss
Merchant Member
This discussion touches on a complaint I have had for years and have voiced here on numerous occasions. That being manufacturers and distributors selling their wares to anyone with the price of admission. In 1988 my company developed a mechanical device for Gerber plotters and started advertising it in all the trade magazines and showing it at industry trade shows. We got a great response from a lot of Gerber owners. About the fifth unit we sold was to a car wash in Pennsylvania. In the years following, we received many inquiries from equipment owners outside of the professional sign making industry.
Even before that, in 1985 Gerber Scientific Products ran a series of ads in magazines like Popular Mechanics to the effect that anyone could be a sign maker in their own garage or basement. That particular campaign was quashed when Butch Anton led a group of sign making pros in protesting the ads.
Today, selling equipment, supplies, software, training and service to anyone with the price of admission is the rule and to the trade only suppliers the extreme exception.
What can you do about it? Here are my suggestions if you would seriously like to improve the situation:
Feel free to create a group here to carry out your discussions or at Facebook etc. Just blowing off steam in a forum post won't be effective or even long remembered. You have at your disposal the power to turn gripes into favorable change.
Even before that, in 1985 Gerber Scientific Products ran a series of ads in magazines like Popular Mechanics to the effect that anyone could be a sign maker in their own garage or basement. That particular campaign was quashed when Butch Anton led a group of sign making pros in protesting the ads.
Today, selling equipment, supplies, software, training and service to anyone with the price of admission is the rule and to the trade only suppliers the extreme exception.
What can you do about it? Here are my suggestions if you would seriously like to improve the situation:
- Organize and discuss your options.
- Determine what practices are acceptable and what practices are not.
- Create a list of which manufacturers and suppliers meet whatever standard you can agree upon.
- Publish what you come up with so the professional community will have their awareness raised and can then decide who they will do business with in the future.
Feel free to create a group here to carry out your discussions or at Facebook etc. Just blowing off steam in a forum post won't be effective or even long remembered. You have at your disposal the power to turn gripes into favorable change.
Fred Weiss
Merchant Member
Signs 101 has a weekly new registration rate of 100 to 200 a week and has been growing at that pace for many years. Many are new shops, others are related operations such as commercial printers expanding into wide format printing including some sign making, and many are simply people looking for better ways to deal with all the new technology.
That is actually exactly what is happening here. We're not simply blowing off steam. In a barrage of emails that were being sent out to wrap shops, I came across the OP who happens to be an active member here, he created a thread, I then added the thread to my email list going out to all Fellers certified wrap shops. Fellers is now officially in the know, they know about this thread already and all their sales reps are getting flooded with calls and emails, including their corporate offices.
Fred Weiss
Merchant Member
Have it your way. I sincerely hope it works out with Fellers. What I suggest, however, would effect all distributors and establish an organized voice for professional sign makers, wrap pros and lots of other related crafts. The standard supplier strategy for dealing with customers is to keep it individual and disorganized. That's how Avery avoided a product liability class action lawsuit in 2004. Your approach plays right into that strategy.
CanuckSigns
Active Member
Seems like a very poor business decision to me, sure he will gain new customers, but the vast majority will be "boy racer" types looking to buy 3 yards of carbon fiber wrap film, to risk alienating clients who buy 10+ rolls of 3m180 & lam a month seems like a very unwise decision
however, I'm sure Frank has weighed this out and still decided it's the way to go, if you don't agree with him, spend your money elsewhere, if you buy from fellers because they are the closest distributor to you, call other distributors like Grimco and tell them, if they have enough demand, they will open another branch near you.
however, I'm sure Frank has weighed this out and still decided it's the way to go, if you don't agree with him, spend your money elsewhere, if you buy from fellers because they are the closest distributor to you, call other distributors like Grimco and tell them, if they have enough demand, they will open another branch near you.
chester215
Just call me Chester.
+1 for Grimco or in New England Garston.
Their rep from Grimco as always been very professional and helpful.
You may want to ask to be taken off of Feller's mailing list when you talk to them.
Their rep from Grimco as always been very professional and helpful.
You may want to ask to be taken off of Feller's mailing list when you talk to them.
AceSignsOnline
New Member
I can't say exactly that I'm indifferent on the matter, but I can't say that this affects me directly in any shape, form, or fashion. I suppose I would feel differently if I still made my living doing banners and vinyl lettering, but that really isn't the case these days.
I honestly don't believe that your average consumer can purchase a few materials from Frank and then turn around and produce anything they'll be happy with by any stretch. There may be a few here and there, but I guarantee they are the exception to the rule. I imagine that Frank will sell a lot more Mossy Oak wrap kits, and maybe become a supply source for a few hobbyists here and there. Beyond that, I can't see this changing much of anything.
Even if Joe Public calls and pays the catalog price for some printable wrap material, I can assure you that he will still pay a lot more for it than I will and it's not even close.
So with that said, I'm probably going to continue giving my business to Feller's. Especially now that I have even more leverage to beat them up on pricing. I think I'll just play the game instead of worrying about things I cannot change.
To each his own.
I honestly don't believe that your average consumer can purchase a few materials from Frank and then turn around and produce anything they'll be happy with by any stretch. There may be a few here and there, but I guarantee they are the exception to the rule. I imagine that Frank will sell a lot more Mossy Oak wrap kits, and maybe become a supply source for a few hobbyists here and there. Beyond that, I can't see this changing much of anything.
Even if Joe Public calls and pays the catalog price for some printable wrap material, I can assure you that he will still pay a lot more for it than I will and it's not even close.
So with that said, I'm probably going to continue giving my business to Feller's. Especially now that I have even more leverage to beat them up on pricing. I think I'll just play the game instead of worrying about things I cannot change.
To each his own.
I just got off the phone with Fellers. The lady said they've had a wave of calls since yesterday.
My gripe was offering the supplies at the same price point as 'us'. I wouldnt be as upset if the pricing was 10%-25% higher than the catalog prices. She said they've always sold to anyone at the catalog prices, which is true, but before the prices were not out in public.
I also said from here on out if/when I buy anything from Fellers, I'll negotiate my price on everything, since now any tom, dick and harry can buy it at catalog price. Not just product I regularly use, but on every item I purchase.
One thing I would like to say, when you call in be respectful, the person on the phone didnt make this change, so dont make them the whipping post for it.
My gripe was offering the supplies at the same price point as 'us'. I wouldnt be as upset if the pricing was 10%-25% higher than the catalog prices. She said they've always sold to anyone at the catalog prices, which is true, but before the prices were not out in public.
I also said from here on out if/when I buy anything from Fellers, I'll negotiate my price on everything, since now any tom, dick and harry can buy it at catalog price. Not just product I regularly use, but on every item I purchase.
One thing I would like to say, when you call in be respectful, the person on the phone didnt make this change, so dont make them the whipping post for it.
HulkSmash
New Member
Fred, I actually 100 percent agree. I made this to make everyone aware. Sometimes I can be go a bit overboard, especially when something like this is effecting my business. I have called fellers and montroy to discuss this. Fellers has had the decency to call me back, montroy has not. I do not have time to start a list, or a group, we are so swamped over here, but I will gladly make phone calls and help out any way I can. I'm not trying to bash anyone, I just find it disrespectful that frank is showing 0 loyalty to the people that made him millions. (thanks biker 
)
This does and has affected my market, probably more then others.
) This does and has affected my market, probably more then others.
TXFB.INS
New Member
I'm sure they were blasted yesterday.
When I called they were over loaded, and the important thing to remember is this choice was done by Frank and Frank alone, so be respectful to the workers
removing the public pricing is a move in the right direction, and this confirms that if we unite then we have the power to change the surroundings
After thinking about I'm all for him leaving the public prices open just make the public pricing 100% more than wholesale or lower his current prices by 50% for wholesale.
There is nothing wrong with selling both wholesale and retail. but they should NEVER be given the same price
When I called they were over loaded, and the important thing to remember is this choice was done by Frank and Frank alone, so be respectful to the workers
removing the public pricing is a move in the right direction, and this confirms that if we unite then we have the power to change the surroundings
After thinking about I'm all for him leaving the public prices open just make the public pricing 100% more than wholesale or lower his current prices by 50% for wholesale.
There is nothing wrong with selling both wholesale and retail. but they should NEVER be given the same price
I just visited fellers.com and saw that myself. Unbelievable! I called and told them that they have one customer less(my company). Obviously is better some ******* from the street that can buy a single roll of vinyl then a company that purchases between 5000-10000 a month in wrap materials. For that reason I am out of their customers list!