Sintra for Exterior Signs

[Farmboy]

How stable is Sintra for permanent outdoor applications? Is it best left for inside displays? Thank you.

 

[visual800]

thickness?

sintra, pvc, komacel......outside we use and routed 3/4" all the time. HOWEVER! There are good brands and cheap ass brands. The cheap brands are very pourous and do not route well also these will warp and seperate from the wall you install them on. INTERFOAM is the brand from Grimco comes in 1/2" and 3/4" it is good stuff

for inside I only use 1/8"-1/4" never outside on these two. I have noticed when pvc first hit market it was all good, then of course some idiot has to add another material in it to save money and now we have inferior brands

 

[signmeup]

I've had bad luck with it outdoors. It warps on me. That said... I am installing a hanging sign made from 3/4" that I had letters routed in. I painted this one and it has 3/4" stainless steel rails down each side for hanging. The last ones were all bare sintra.

 

[Marlene]

thick stuff, good brand works OK. I bought a 1" thick blank from Hooks & Lattices and it has been outside for a while and it OK. thin 3mm will get brittle and will warp.

 

[daveb]

I've had bad luck with it outdoors. It warps on me.

We've found that if you paint both sides it works just fine outside, we only use 1/2'' and 3/4'' for routed dimensional lettering anymore. I won't use bare PVC outside anymore, I just don't like the way it weathers, after a few years the edges get dark and dirty looking and seem to swell a little.:Big Laugh

 

[andy]

Manufacturers alter the cost of foam PVC sheet by simply increasing or decreasing the amount of air they force into the mixed chemicals. The cheaper the sheet the greater the air content.

Increased air content creates a much rougher cell structure which gives nasty rough cut edges. More air means more bubbles... the air inside these expands when the sheet gets warm... that's why cheap PVC warps so much.

If you want smooth "grain" edges and non warping characteristics you need to ask your supplier for foamed PVC with the lowest possible air content.

 

[Jillbeans]

With you in NY, I wouldn't do it.
I've had it crack and warp.
Love....Jill

 

[Sign Eagle]

Thin PVC get brittle when cold, if you're in a snowy area, a snowball can brake the sign. Wouldn't think 1/2" or thick would be a problem

 

[Gino]

No matter what thickness.... it all expands and contracts at a very fast rate. Usually faster than paint or vinyl can stay adhered to. When its very cold, that's when you have problems with breakage. When its hot, that's when you have problems with warping. As mentioned the thicker you go, the problems are much less, but then why spend that kinda money on an inferior product ?? Isn't it easier to get the appropriate product ??

If you want to use, I'd say go ahead and find out for yourself if it's any good.

 

[Letterbox Mike]

Ditto what everybody else says, good high-quality 3/4"+ thick PVC works fine outside. We've been using it for 7 or 8 years in place of MDO for permanent signs and haven't seen a failure (or any warping) with it. I agree, painting it yields a better long-term product.

 

[signmeup]

As mentioned the thicker you go, the problems are much less, but then why spend that kinda money on an inferior product ?? Isn't it easier to get the appropriate product ??

If you want to use, I'd say go ahead and find out for yourself if it's any good.

OK... I'll bite. What would the appropriate product be?

 

[Brandon708]

Best for indoor due to it being brittle. We have replaced many of these signs. (someone else made them) Outside we like to use Aluminum, Max Metal, Coroplast, 10mm coroplast, omega board.

 

[SignManiac]

Like anything else, you need to learn what you can and can not do with it. I use it a lot here in florida where it gets really hot. Light colors work best as they reflect heat. Darker colors absorb and then expand. Even with expansion, if you allow for it and give the material room to move, you're okay. If the entire sign is made with the same pvc, it will all expand together. Where you have to be careful is when mixing with different materials that have different expansion rates.
Thicker material is more stable, however you can laminate thinner parts together with pvc cement and build added strength into it. Lots of tricks to learn, but it can be a great product to work with once you learn some things about it.

 

[Farmboy]

Thanks for all the replies. Like I stated maybe about a month ago, I'm bored with the Cut Vinyl and Digital stuff we do. That and there are 2 new shops in the area doing the same thing. So I'm looking to build on what we offer for my own sake and the sake of the business. I love the look of the dimensional signs I see but am in no way going to spend the cash for a routing table. I guess I could buy some sheets of HDU and try my hand at carving, but again...cha ching. So I thought I'd play with Sintra because the cost is lower. Thinking I'll turn my eye's towards Poly Metal Panels and see what trouble I can get into with them.

 

[signmeup]

Hand carving HDU needs a break away blade knife and a few cheap cabinet chisels and a set of those little caving tools you see in hardware stores. At least that's what I use.

 

[Farmboy]

Hand carving HDU needs a break away blade knife and a few cheap cabinet chisels and a set of those little caving tools you see in hardware stores.

and skills. Which I ain't got runnin though my veins like some of these folks here

 

[TheSnowman]

We've had it warp, we've had it crack, and we've had it stay perfectly fine. I suppose it depends on the application and how long they expect it to last. I wouldn't warrant it...that's for sure.

 

[petrosgraphics]

we have used a lot of pvc... 3/4" and 1/2" for outdoor use...... you have to be careful

with a s/f pole mounted sign, here in the n.e. it will break, if it gets hit with flying

chunks of snow......

 

[Farmboy]

So way off topic (sorta)...for want to try something new I printed off one of my photos (side hobby) as CMYK seps for the hell off it. I was surprised to say the least as how well it came out. I have never tried my hand at process printing before and figured what the hell. Now I have something new to be stoked about.http://www.signs101.com/photopost/showfull.php?photo=4347

 

[kage]

So way off topic (sorta)...for want to try something new I printed off one of my photos (side hobby) as CMYK seps for the hell off it. I was surprised to say the least as how well it came out. I have never tried my hand at process printing before and figured what the hell. Now I have something new to be stoked about.http://www.signs101.com/photopost/showfull.php?photo=4347

that's pretty cool, havent tried my hand at process yet but when I do if my first came out as good I'd have the encouragement to keep at it.

As far as Cintra tho', Ive heard bad things about outdoor use...but, i like the stuff ... so I laminate it with sign vinyl as a base colour (even white)... then put everything on. We dont get alot of sun like say... Cali or Arizona but so far i have a sign of 1/8'' that has been out for about 2 years and has not cracked or discoloured (hopefully not because of luck) and a Thick sammich Board in a really windy part of the coast that still looks great after a couple years. I did explain my concerns to the customers and they agreed if it fails they will have them replaced.
Fingers crossed.