kerning goddesses and gods

[slappy]

Which of these two layouts is the correct way to do the kerning between "UP" in supervisor on this font???




so much!

 

[Fred Weiss]

The left one IMHO.

 

[Marlene]

left looks better

 

[slappy]

thank you Fred and Marlene, ... just wanted to know before i got them screened.

thanks a bunch!

 

[Billct2]

If you're being really fussy, neither, along with many other kerning issues like that big hole between the V & I. I didn't search for the eact font but here's my take.

 

[slappy]

If you're being really fussy, neither, along with many other kerning issues like that big hole between the V & I.

lol... i seen that after i posted the attachments and was like oh no, there is another one! lol

I'm just going to do the left layout as it is and not get fussy cause then the whole layout, that has already been approved, will look like impact or knockout or something entirely different when he comes to pick them up....
but i'm still kinda wondering how to kern this font right... oh well.

Does anyone have that kerning game bookmarked?

 

[John Butto]

The #2, right one, and move the first S a little to the left and the V closer to the I.

 

[slappy]

i'll fix it here after a bit and post later, but more then likely i'll just leave it alone...

I gotta go pick up my boy and cook dinner so i'm logging out.

i thank you all

 

[visual800]

the right one if i was laying it out

 

[bob]

All of the examples shown are incorrect.

Many of the Roman characters violate the body of their neighbors. That's why something set in all uppercase italics is generally considered to be dubious typography. It often looks unpleasant. Especially using a type face with serifs.

I fully understand that soft type characters can be jammed up to trespass on their neighbors space and it often looks pleasing to the ignorant eye. If you reached your majority before the era of soft type it just looks wrong in some undefined but unsettling way.

This is Yet Another one of those instances where merely because you can do something does not mean you should do it.

 

[John Butto]

loosen up

Albrecht Dürer would love to hear your theory on roman characters violating their neighbors. And by the way the Romans were known to violate their neighbors quite often. As you can see from the photo that the Roman stone carvers were not to concern about their spacing as the modern world is. Kerning started when type was invented and that is also how the word leading came to be used. I hate to challenge you on this Bob because usually you have some great insights but when Motzart was told he should only write operas in Italian we would never be able to enjoy The Magic Flute.

 

[Jillbeans]

Second one, I needs fixed too.
John R needs a period after the R.
Love....Jill

 

[SignProPlus-Chip]

Think of the space between letters as water. Each space between should be filled with the same amount of water.

That is the BEST advice I ever got about kerning from my old high school design teacher. Mrs. Alma Beckwith, who was, if I recall correctly, the niece of Norman Rockwell.

With that said #2 has better spacing.

 

[Craig Sjoquist]

Right ... but even that one has kerning serious problems like that V-I


Kerning has a few view points ..tight it looks nice but hard to read open it up & equal it reads well, to much it's appeal is less, open up even more there must be a reason for appeal.. normally you can kern as much as 1-1/2 the size of stroke.



If you read Mike Stevens ..Mastering Layout .. or went to a good school you would have learned this ...folks

 

[Z SIGNS]

Kerning and doing a good job with your layouts is very important and jobs like this are a good place to practice.But on a job like this I wouldn't stress over it.

 

[bob]

Albrecht Dürer would love to hear your theory on roman characters violating their neighbors. And by the way the Romans were known to violate their neighbors quite often. As you can see from the photo that the Roman stone carvers were not to concern about their spacing as the modern world is. Kerning started when type was invented and that is also how the word leading came to be used. I hate to challenge you on this Bob because usually you have some great insights but when Motzart was told he should only write operas in Italian we would never be able to enjoy The Magic Flute.

With the advent of moveable type, around 1450ce, there evolved rules for typography. Actually guidelines rather than rules. One rule that was inherent in the physical nature of moveable type was the concept of the inviolability of the type body.

Since each character was cast on a rectangular slug, a single character was bound by that rectangle. No part of any character could extend beyond its bounding rectangle**. That being the case, no part of any character could occupy any part of any neighboring character's bounding rectangle. This was not merely an arbitrary rule, it was physically impossible.

Hence the development of ligatures.

Since the coming of soft type there is no type body and thus nothing to violate. But...for the past ~600 years, which span contains virtually all of the time that printed material has been universally distributed and seen, the sovereignty of the type body has been the physical reality and has become the visual norm. Improper typography is not usually apparent as such to most people, it just doesn't look right and subconsciously makes them uncomfortable.

**There are certain specimen type faces that violate this with irregularly shaped slugs. Generally these encroachments are decorative extensions like long tails on 'Q's etc. Moreover, creative type setters have been known to file, notch, and otherwise modify slugs for various special purposes.