Major Vinyl problems!!!!!!!!!! :-(

[Bigdawg]

well i see blisters and wrinkles.... do you?

I think he's saying they weren't there when he installed... but have appeared more recently? Is that right Bob?

 

[rcook99]

Techman if you look at the original post you will see that the wrinkles were NOT there when it was installed. To clearify no those weren't there when the job was done.

 

[heyskull]

I don't think anyone has said this.
But was that vehicle freshly painted?
I haven't seen anything as bad as that in years and only when where I worked had a paint shop and the customers weren't willing to let us graphic there vehicles at a later date after been in the paintshop.
That looks like the paint is still outgassing!
This will cause bubbles and creases and affect the vinyl to shrink because of the solvents.
I have used Oracal 651 for years and never came up with any problems.

SC

 

[rcook99]

I had to look back at the paperwork and found the Black is a Cast vinyl and the burgandy is a Calendered vinyl. I figure this will help.

 

[heyskull]

I've used cast and caladered on top of each with no problem.
But it could be the problem.
Were the vehicles recently painted?

SC

 

[Bigdawg]

I had to look back at the paperwork and found the Black is a Cast vinyl and the burgandy is a Calendered vinyl. I figure this will help.

The calendared is shrinking on top of the cast... drawing it in...

EDITED TO ADD: I've found the reds and burgandys tend to shrink faster anyway... just my personal experience...

 

[Border]

I had to look back at the paperwork and found the Black is a Cast vinyl and the burgandy is a Calendered vinyl. I figure this will help.

I'd bet that's the problem. I've mixed the 2 before for a small, odd job here and there but never on a vehicle that sees extreme conditions.
At any rate, I'd say you don't stand a chance of warranty at all, having mixed the two.

 

[cptcorn]

I had to look back at the paperwork and found the Black is a Cast vinyl and the burgandy is a Calendered vinyl. I figure this will help.

That's your problem right there. Replace them all... Chalk it up to a learning experience... No manufacture will warranty what you did.

 

[Billct2]

Yowch....

 

[TheSnowman]

Mosh actually had a good point. Are the 4' X 8's doing it? If they aren't...then you know it's something that the vehicle is going through, if they are...then yea, it's totally the cal/cast combo bittin' ya in the butt.

 

[Mosh]

I had to look back at the paperwork and found the Black is a Cast vinyl and the burgandy is a Calendered vinyl. I figure this will help.

There you go. Looks like you are re-lettering, sorry.

 

[Poconopete]

The white you see around the two layers is actually wax.

From ORACAL's site: Do not apply carnauba-based wax over vinyl graphics.

 

[kev3232]

Mosh I use a ton of Oracal 651 on vehicles (yes I offer 'em 751 but they always want cheap... you should understand that ) and I've never seen that happen... I have vehicles that have been on the road upward of 4 years that still look good.

I don't understand the bunching underneath...

i'll send you some shots of oracal 651 from another supplier from about 3 years ago! crap!! even on flat surfaces!

 

[rcook99]

Ok I just checked the 4*8 sign.and that looks as good as the day I installed it. The sign backer is Fiber brite. So if the layered vinyl was the problem as some of you suggested in previous post why is it not a problem on the two other signs.

 

[Bigdawg]

I like my 651 and it has done well for me... both that and the 751 are what I use most. Can not stand Avery. I've used the Oracal for almost 5 years - not long I know but I never promised any more than 2 or 3 on the 651 to anyone... and it has wayyyy out performed that so far... and we layered the heck out of it (no printer then so about everything was cut vinyl)

But rcook's problem is mixing that calendared and cast IMHO... for ANY brand that is just not a good thing...

 

[Gino]

Without knowing the exact procedure you used... it looks like a combination of things.

• Definitely the cal over cast is a BIG no~no.
• The surface might've been contaminated, but I doubt it.
• The company's cleaning procedure could be causing it, but again, I doubt it.
• As mentioned, certain colors do shrink faster than others and I too agree that maroon is notorious for that.

The way the black has shrunk, and that's your cast part.... I think you have some faulty vinyl.


Over the years... almost all of these things you're all saying to avoid.... we have done for whatever reasons and for probably 98% of them... no failures. I believe if you use a good manufacturer and follow all of the proper steps involved in installation, you won't have a problem. Heck, sometimes just mixing different manufactures high performance [cast] will result in problems. Cast is not always interchangeable just because you switch brands to get a perfect color.

Now the trick question..... did you do these wet ??

That's the only thing we don't do when mixing things up a bit.

An after thought... I'm not suggesting or implying in any way, shape or form to mix grades of vinyl within a manufacturers grades or between various manufacturers... just that we did it without problems many many times. Follow the manufacturers warranties and instructions when installing anything and you should be fine. ​

 

[Mosh]

I don't even stock any 651, we only use high performance on everything. Cheapo stuff like banners we print. Knock my pricing and my hair, but don't knock me for using cheap materials cause I don't do that!

 

[BadAss]

Well if your doing a horizontal surface, There is NO Warranty on it from any of the big 3 man. So as I was told if you do hoods, Do it in 651 and save the money. Cause if you spend the extra doe on 751 you will still have failure within a year. I am going through this "Right Now" and I have used 751 as Mosh, cause I only wanted to use Hi Per. But after a year the hoods on 34 tow trucks are doing exactly what your photos show. And they were all done in 751 and I charged more and told the client it was because we wanted them to last longer then the ones we have done over the years in 651. I get a call this week to come look at the trucks and sure enough, they look like hell. I call the rep. They say horizontal placement along with desert enviorment "Will not last a year cast or calendared".. So I get to re-do some hoods and try to get the customer to understand....

 

[Poconopete]

They say horizontal placement along with desert enviorment "Will not last a year cast or calendared"..

Interesting, so what did they use for the decals on hoods of say Trans Ams, Jeep Golden Eagles...

 

[rcook99]

These were all vertical applications on Chevy express vans.